Whats the deal with lead????

Discussion in 'Terminal Tackle Review' started by field989, Jul 11, 2006.

  1. field989

    field989 New Member

    Messages:
    896
    State:
    east central indiana
    i got a question about lead....

    every thing u buy that is lead has a warning.
    why do we use so much lead if it may cause cancer... birth defects...and other reporductive harm.....


    so why do we use so much lead..... if it is so bad

    thanks.

    Jeff
     
  2. Whistler

    Whistler Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,084
    State:
    TN
    If lead is used properly it's not harmful at all. If ingested it is bad stuff. As long as you are just using it as most of us do for sinkers, it's not bad at all. Keep your hands clean if you are handling it a lot, and if you make your own sinkers, follow the instructions that came with your molds regarding fumes and you'll be fine.
     

  3. field989

    field989 New Member

    Messages:
    896
    State:
    east central indiana
    ok....

    i know in shot guns most shells are lead.....

    but i try and go with steel.... i like it..... might be a bit pricier but i will deal with it...
     
  4. shortshank

    shortshank New Member

    Messages:
    389
    State:
    Oregon
    Once again, living proof...you hang around on here you will learn something! The muffin pan, what a great way to stock a melting pot. Never tried that but soon as it gets dark mother may get burgled.
    Don
     
  5. Coyote1

    Coyote1 New Member

    Messages:
    640
    State:
    Missouri
    Dear Jeff;
    If I might take a moment of your time I think I can expand a little bit on what Whistler told you.
    What Whistler said about working with, and around lead is absolutely 100% CORRECT! :smile2:
    First of all, a bit about Lead itself. It's atomic weight is 82. It is found in solid, liquid, and gaseous form. It is a grayish to bluish white, soft, malleable, metal that is a poor electrical conductor and has a melting point of aproximately 621.59 degrees Fahrenheit.
    It has been used in paints and pesticides, fine glassware, acromatic lenses, solider, insulation both sound and nuclear, and batteries, to name just a few of it's uses. It is also a cumulative poison but a bit more on that later too.
    But to answer your question in a bit more detail we have to go back a few years. Back to the 20th Century in fact!:roll_eyes: :big_smile:
    This "problem" with lead started several years ago when wildlife biologists that monitored our Flyways for the miagratory birds started noticing birth defects and fewer and fewer young birds being born healthy or even born at all in some cases! Bald Eagles is one example that I am most familar with because we now have a viable Bald Eagle "Clan" up across the big river from St. Louis, MO. This is but one success story.
    Getting back to the Lead story, the biologists did a bunch of checking, testing, and a whole bunch of other things that are way out of my league! Simply put, the birds were ingesting lead pellets in their diet. The pellets, as was explained to me, were the very same ones used in Shotgun loads! The pellets were falling back into the very waters that the birds rested at, gathered their food at, and as such, it was getting into their systems.
    This is why Lead shot is illegal to use on Federal Game Flyways. This was the big reason for Steel Shot, and later on, tungsten, bismuth{peptol bismol in another form!} and other such substitutes to try and find a substance that had the same physical properties, flight characteristics, penetration power, ect, as Lead did. Well, thats another story that I won't get into right now because it's a somewhat long one too. Sufficient to say, we've come close enough that the substitutes, although $$EXPENSIVE$$ in most cases, work, ... good enough to use anyway.
    It is also why we now use Lead-Free gasolines. Lead was used to retard detonation in antomobile engines and once used in the combustion process, was extruded out the tailpipe and into our atmosphere!
    The downside of Lead is that where human beings are concerned, it can be absorbed through your skin, your breath, and your tongue.
    Once in, it's very, very, hard to get out if at all! Yes, sometimes the human body can, over long periods of time, shed the substance from their systems, and research is promising, but the best bet is NOT get it in your system in the first place because lead is a cumulative poison. That is to say it builds and builds within the human body and does not easily leave, if at all!
    Lead causes, central nervious system disorders, liver failure along with damage to the other organs especially the BRAIN!!!:sad2:
    These effects, once the damage is done, is permanent! They found that small children, most of whom lived in low income housing, or, and I am going to just come out and say it, SLUMS, would eat paint chips and ingest lead over a period of time. There were severe learning disorders, extremely depressed motor function and coordination, permanent liver damage, stunted growth, and other nasty symptoms.
    For several years now it has been illegal, by Federal Law, to manufacture paint containing lead for home use! But, as you can guess, the damage that has already been done is irreversable!
    The above is also why in some lakes, well let's just say in more and more fishing areas, your required to use copper, tungsten, or other materials such as steel for your sinkers.
    Homes built today cannot have lead plumbing in them as they were in old times. Not too many years ago lead was still used to seal your toilet to the septic drainlines in your homes! Of course, today they use a wax ring or something even better. But I am not a plumber by trade, so I can't properly advice you on that subject!
    Your also seeing lead being phased out of use for bullets for use in firearms. More and more bullets are being made out of copper and the old fashioned lead tip, that worked so well for so many, many, years is now being replaced by polymer tips of various colors. Even big game cartridges for say Dangerous Game such as Bear, Elephant, and other African Big Game are being made out of copper with a tungsten insert in alignment with the longitudinal axis of the bullet. I suspect that by the year 2010 Lead Bullets will mostly be a "Thing of The Past". Greater strides are being made in centerfire caliber bullets than in shotgun pellets. This is because of the ballistics involved that I won't go into because again, this is my speciality and I could talk all night about that one subject alone!
    Sufficient to say, Lead, improperly used has severe and long term effects that usually, slowly, build up so that by the time you notice anything wrong, ... it's usually a bit too late too!
    However, do as Whistler advised you, do NOT breath lead fumes, especially the ones you cannot see!, wash you hands after pouring it into your sinker molds, and just plain old common sense and you will never have to worry about lead poisoning. That is unless that catfish start shooting at us! In which case I will retire from Catfishing real fast!!!:roll_eyes: :big_smile: :lol: But that is "Lead Poisoning" of a different kind best to be saved for another time, another day.
    Hope this helps answer some of your questions. If you need more information you can use your computer search engines. Everyone from the American Medical Association to the EPA[oh boy do they ever!!] to the Professional X-Ray & Nuclear Medical Technicians Association, and many, many, more have enough information to meet anyones needs!
    Take Care, "Walk In Peace"
    Fraternally,
    Coyote1
    [[[[[End of Message]]]]]
     
  6. catseeman

    catseeman New Member

    Messages:
    1,189
    State:
    Indianapolis, Indiana
    Good post Ed. The reports of eagle decline i read blamed DDT weakened the eggshells not so muck as lead poisoning.
     
  7. Coyote1

    Coyote1 New Member

    Messages:
    640
    State:
    Missouri
    Dear Brother Leonard;
    I stand corrected on that point.
    The DDT problem was more prevalent out in the Pacific Northwest of the lower 48 and got a lot more writeup by the news media.
    Here where I live {St. Louis, MO} about ohh 50 miles, or so, south is called the "Lead Belt". At one time, again back in the 19th and 20th centurys this was one of the largest Lead Ore producing areas in the World! Matter of fact, I believe only a site in the Old Soviet Union/Russia/USSR along the Siberian Mountain Range produced more!
    Our area is now shut down, health, federal regulations, ect, and there are a couple of smaller sites here in the U.S.A. but, off the top of my head, I'm not sure exactly of the locations, I think one is near a silver mining area in Nevada and one up in Wyoming somewhere.
    The reason I know about all of this is because my wife is a native born and raised St. Louisan and of course there was No Way I Could NOT Know About It!:roll_eyes: If your a married man, or have been married, then you know exactly what I am talking about here! :roll_eyes: :big_smile: :lol:
    But yes, DDT did get the big news media "explosion" because of the Osprey and our Bald Eagle out in the pacific northwest and the pacific flyway.
    After that, and more examinations, tests, and all that other biological stuff that I have no idea how to do, they found Lead damage in the central part of the lower 48 along the Central and Mississippian {not sure about the spelling} and in the Southeast quardrent of the CONUS too. I guess because of so much more marsh and swamp lands but I'm only guessing on that one.
    "Thank You" for correcting me on that. I dunno why I didn't put that tidbit in my post as I was keeping up with the DDT findings back in the "80's" and early "90's" too!
    I hate it when I'm not as accurate as I should be! I don't do many posts but those that I do get in on I try to be as accurate as possible.
    Thankfully, at least I had you to back me up and whisper in my ear!:big_smile: I think that is one of the reasons it's called the "Brotherhood".
    Thanks Again,
    Fraternally,
    Coyote1
    [[[[[End of corrected post]]]]]
     
  8. IL Hunter

    IL Hunter New Member

    Messages:
    1,574
    State:
    Normal, IL
    Dude steel shot sucks. You have to use it for waterfowl, unless you want to shell out big bucks for hevi-shot or something similar. lead is more dense than steel and has more knock down power so you can use smaller shot and more of it.
     
  9. field989

    field989 New Member

    Messages:
    896
    State:
    east central indiana
    i use steel for squirrels....

    works just fine...

    i like it..

    different strokes for different folks....

    plus u dont have to worry aobut eatin it



    Jeff
     
  10. badkarma

    badkarma New Member

    Messages:
    772
    State:
    Oxford,Miss
    I've been around melted lead for over 45 years and I was around lead in gas,paint and I have taken baths in DDT and I'm still here so what's the big deal?I don't duck hunt,I have never duck hunted and I never will duck hunt,I have never made a dime from ducks but have had to duck birdshot from duck hunters that were running the deer off by shooting so much and have more game wardens around because of duckhunters while trying to hunt some real meat.I always thought the only time lead was harmful was if you were standing in front of the gun.
     
  11. cook

    cook New Member

    Messages:
    1,494
    State:
    Plattsburg,Mo.(near K.C.)
    Great post,Ed.

    A little clarification on lead ban for waterfowl.
    They were ingesting the shot in the form of "grit" as land based birds or chickens will.While this no doubt caused some deaths,there is great debate about the accuracy of the studies.It was mainly based (or started) in Mn.,where the study of Loon population decrease was done.
    Either way,once a law is in the books,it ain't coming off.
    The lead ban in shotgun shell is starting to spread to Federal and BLM lands for all types of hunting.

    Don't use your teeth to crimp on slit-shot to the line,use pliers.
     
  12. catfishkatmando

    catfishkatmando New Member

    Messages:
    494
    State:
    Salem, WV.
    When my dog cisco was 3mths old he ate a 1 oz barrel sinker and passed it and he is still kicking .
     
  13. Mr.T

    Mr.T Active Member

    Messages:
    2,554
    State:
    MO
    You'll note that the label says "contains a chemical KNOWN TO THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA..." It's my opinion that the State of California "knows" a lot of things that aren't necessarily fact.

    The labels are required by California law on products that will be sold in California that contain certain chemicals, etc.. The manufacturers just take the easy route and put the label on all their packaging.
     
  14. gofish

    gofish New Member

    Messages:
    658
    State:
    Greenville MS
    :lol: That's when lead is MOST harmful.
     
  15. canebreaker

    canebreaker Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,311
    State:
    Southaven,MS
    The state of California can't battle a forest fire. They want to use water, can't dig trenches because you may kill off some animal. Like the fire won't harm it, right!