WEIGHT FOR MAXIMUM DISTANCE

Discussion in 'All Catfishing' started by USCA-RECLAIMED-ACCOUNT, Jan 12, 2010.

  1. USCA-RECLAIMED-ACCOUNT

    USCA-RECLAIMED-ACCOUNT New Member

    Messages:
    3,020
    Been fishing a few new spots this past year where I need some serious distance from shore.I,m doing alright,but I got a few questions for some of you serious distance casters.Most of my river fishing has to be done with weights from 6-12zs to hold bottom.I,m just trying to find out if others have found a maximum weight where distance starts dropping off after adding more weight?I usually got live gills on, so the setup aint real aerodynamic.As for tackle,I use a couple Daiwa Saltist 30,s on 7ft Bigwater Uglies for 75 yds or less and 10oz and under.I got a Saltist 40 on a 12ftXH Bigwater that,s rated up to 24ozs.I know I could get farther on spinning gear,but i,m pretty set in my ways on the casting gear.I know there,s some guys on here that surfcast also.I,ve been trying to work on technique too and have checked out quite a few videos on the different casting techniques.I,m buying a few more molds in the next couple weeks and was trying to get a little more info on the weight end of things.Does anyone find the sinker shape affecting distance.I,ll be using something that don,t roll on the bottom,I need that.Just trying to get from feedback from fellow USCA brothers.
     
  2. tricitycatter

    tricitycatter Member

    Messages:
    354
    State:
    Washington
    Thanx for bringing that up. I have not yet used no-roll sinkers, cause the cost verses the cannonball & teardrop sinkers, once they get into something (gravel & rocks) it is hard to get the weight back. I really need to work on my casting too, I can only get about 6 oz on before I can't get musch more distance. I use spinning reels strictly (too retarded to figure out bait casting), I just got 9' rods this winter & am still getting used to them.
     

  3. bluecatnut

    bluecatnut New Member

    Messages:
    891
    State:
    freeburg illinois
    with my 7000 on a 10 ft glow stik i like 8 oz and thats gettin out their between 100-150 but with my 15ft and okuma 90 i like 10 oz and can toss them damn close to 200 yrd u should see how big the eyes get on boaters when they see a chunk of bait fly over their heads it's priceless
    one more thing i like using a smaller diameter line also ..
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2010
  4. Catfishboy1995

    Catfishboy1995 New Member

    Messages:
    3,104
    State:
    Council Bluffs
    I got smacked by a 10oz weight the otherday(The kind you use)...And a Piece of fish(The bait you use..) I think you owe me 1,000,000 For fishing gear just for hitting me in the head (The date you were fishing..)
     
  5. ste6168

    ste6168 New Member

    Messages:
    622
    State:
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Pat, it all depends on the rod you are using and your casting technique. IMO, those big water uglies are not good casters. I have a 10ft TICA that I can throw 4-6oz's about 140yds with. Like you said, casting a whole gill and 6+ oz of weight is not very aerodynamic and I think anything over 100yds is a great cast. It's not really about the "max" weight where the distance starts to go down, its more about the weight the rod can throw (if you get what I mean). For example, if you have a 12ft OM rod rated for 3-6, once you get above 8 or so (those rods have been known to be rated less than what they can throw), your distance will decrease because the rod does not load properly, but if you have to little weight on, again the rod will not load properly and you will again lose distance. Same thing with the 6-12, if you are throwing less than 6, the rod will not load well and you will lose distance, but if you throw more than say 14, its not going to load well. Almost all rods are going to have a "sweet spot," but that can change from one caster to the next depending on THEIR casting form. Take your rods out to a football field for a day and have a ball!

    I would bet (if your 12ft'r is anything like my 9ft'r) that you cant load that rod properly with less than ~8oz. Once you figure that out, youll get the distance your looking for!

    Also, your comment about getting more distance form a spinning reel is definetely wrong. All the long distance casting records have been set with casting reels, usually Abu 5xxx series all tricked out (magged, levelwind removed, bearings, etc). As far as lead types when casting, IMO, I think whatever lead holds best for you is going to work. If you were casting small top/bottom rigs then the weight would come into play, but the whole bluegill is going to cause far more air resistance than the lead.
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2010
  6. ste6168

    ste6168 New Member

    Messages:
    622
    State:
    Pittsburgh, PA
    One more thing, the 100lb braid and 40lb mono is not going to help with casting distance, no matter what rod, reel, weight you got on. A lot of distance casters and surf fisherman who are getting real distance are using a 40-80lb shock leader backed by 12-20lb test. That way they have the thin diameter line to get long smooth casts, but they also have a heavy enough line to take the "shock" from the force you put into a long distance cast!
     
  7. mrmarkedwards

    mrmarkedwards Active Member

    Messages:
    919
    State:
    Delaware
    ok first off as long as you understand that there is no way you're going to cast a live fish more than 50 yds and have it survive. now as far as your setups i mostly agree with mike you are going to have to "get to know your rods" that means getting a bunch of sinkers that in the rods casting wieght range and cast them to find the sweet spot for your rod. so lets say your rod is rated for 3-8oz(work with here) get some 1-8oz sinkers and cast each of them at least 5xand record each cast's distance 110ft,112ft ect do that for each wieght and then look at your results if it a surf rod more than likely your best distance will come with 5oz want to know why? because most surf rods are built to cast 5oz the best since the most likely beach conditions will call for a 4oz sinker and a bait. now back to our rod say you peak at 5oz at 360ft then 6oz hit 355,352,356 and 8 oz hits 346, 348 and say 342 now you can go back and use a 2oz and a bigger bait and still be casting 5oz of total wieght or 6oz and a small bait.

    now on to the reel. spiining reels are fine just make sure your gathering guide(the one closest to the reel) is almost the same size as your reel spool the only exceptions to this rule are 1 a reel loaded with braid or 2 a long cast spool loaded with mono. but either way during this time off year strip the reel and if it has an aluminum spool polish it with some car wax especially one with teflon. and if you aren't already using it switch to braid 50lb has 10lb mono diameter and that can increase your casting distance by 50% without doing anything else.

    casting technique the easiest one to learn is the foundation for all extreme distance cast if you google unitech, high inertia or brighton cast tthen you are learning to crawl before you can walk. this cast is great because it can be done in a crowd and give you great distance. since you're using spinning gear look into getting a leather work glove to protect your hand and by leather i mean genuine not these psuedo leathers they won't hold up and when you hit a good cast that mono shockleader will cut through it like grant through richmond. speaking of that i suggest using 40-80 mono go 5 wraps around the spool up through the tip and back down to the reel that should last you all day.

    lastly rigs if you're going to use a slip rig then you'll want to shorten that hook leader because as you go to cast the sinker starts then the bait gets pulled into the cast(pulling your hook through the bait) then on impact your sinker is hitting the water at speeds of 40-70mph then the surface tension of the water pulls your hook even further through your bait most guys will swear when they reel their bait back in they had a bite and most likely they didn't.

    now here is where i disagree with mike baitcaster reels may own the top distance on the tournament casting scene but like you said they have to be tricked out with rocket fuel, ceramic bearings and easily adjusted tension knobs spinning reels don't need any of that they are ready to rumble right out the box. but even on the tournament scene you know what? most of those reels never see water and they few that do see water get put away at sunset and here come the spinning reels. or bad weather comes up and out come the spinning reels. and when i retired from distance casting i missed out on 3 straight national championships by a grand total of 17 feet. thats combined over the 3 years i never finished more than 10 feet from the winner and at the end of the day when we went fishing i was using the same rod and reel while they where switching rods and reels.
     
  8. kawriverrat

    kawriverrat Member

    Messages:
    143
    State:
    KANSAS
    I agree with ste6168 the perch is your biggest issue. To much air resistance.
     
  9. Hunt4lyf

    Hunt4lyf New Member

    Messages:
    30
    State:
    Colorado
    Hey BCP, I asked this same thing last year and mrmarkedwards posted an answer quite similar to what he just posted and just last friday I was practicing with a new 15 ft ugly, okuma spinning reel and 40 lb braid and my longest cast was 370 ft, that's with no bait mind you. I used the brighton cast he recommended, works great. Last summer I was consistantly throwing 270 ft out fishing with a piece of cutbait and a 4 oz weight on a 9 ft pole. Looking forward to this season...
     
  10. USCA-RECLAIMED-ACCOUNT

    USCA-RECLAIMED-ACCOUNT New Member

    Messages:
    3,020
    Thanks gentlemen,lot of good stuff been posted to think about.I already use braid,but it,s usually #80.I usually use a slip rig too.Mark-all the reels i,m using are non-levelwind casting reels.I,m gonna check out those casting videos some more and do a little practice casting down the river when it warms up some next week.I need the distance at a couple spots,but I Wanna be able to land em more.I,m still gonna have to be able to put some pressure on em to keep them from running me around some bridge piers.Thanks again for everybodys input!:Happy:
     
  11. steveturner024

    steveturner024 Active Member

    Messages:
    825
    State:
    Illinois
    Name:
    Steve Turner
    I have 2 12' H bigwater uglystiks with tidewater spinning reels. I can cast 4oz and bait much farther than 8oz and bait. The rods are rated for 2-12oz lure I believe. IMO, I would just go fishing and practice while your there so your casting your bait and everything. I think your bait is causing a lot of the problem. The different style sinkers shouldn't matter that much when you have a big gill on there.
     
  12. alton

    alton New Member

    Messages:
    1,045
    State:
    Illinois
    Pat

    It looks like you have been given some solid input. Mark Edwards knows a ton more than most about distance casting. Tim "Tiny" Smith is also a good source on the subject, but I have not seen a post from him for awhile.

    I have gone through the same issues you are talking about the last couple of years. I have to say the rod is certainly the most important part of the set up, which includes the lure rating for the rod of choice. I also use casting equipment, I use to use spinning reels, but went back to casting.

    I have found adequate casting rods seem to be a bit more expensive than adequate spinning rods. The rods I use are are 12' Okuma Solaris Surf casting with 3oz - 8oz lure rating. I feel the best distance set up on these rods is 5 or 6oz and bait. I also use an Ocean Master Cape Point 12' with a lure rating of 6-12oz which is a beast. I am sure this rod would perform best using 8oz and bait. I am not strong enough to adequately load this rod. I only use this when I feel the chances of catching a blue 50lb and over is there.
    I use Abu 6500 and 7000 reels with #65 Power Pro. When used with the Solaris Surf rods, which are graphite, it makes for a very and easy to handle set up. I have caught quite a few blues in the 20-50lb range with no problems.

    I guess to sum up this rambling response, I would say for casting distance, I feel the most important factors are: Rod Length - Lure rating - Small Diameter line - and techinque, which I have none. Good luck.
     
  13. alton

    alton New Member

    Messages:
    1,045
    State:
    Illinois
    I hope you have better luck with the 12' big water casting rod than I had. I purchased one a couple of years ago and used it one morning and returned it. The lure rating of 24oz is a bit of a stretch I believe. I also fish only the river which at times has a strong current. The rod had too much flex for me. I just could not see trying to land a #20-#50 blue against the current with this rod. I am sure it is a good rod for a lake or still water.
     
  14. tricitycatter

    tricitycatter Member

    Messages:
    354
    State:
    Washington
    Thanx everybody for the great advice, I know that the rods I have are not the greatest for big weight, so I use as little as I can get away with, but I find that Trees/brush/&slope of the bank affect how far a cast I can get, I intend on practicing more & figuring out the sweet spot. Thanx again Pat for bringing this & everyone for the info.
     
  15. USCA-RECLAIMED-ACCOUNT

    USCA-RECLAIMED-ACCOUNT New Member

    Messages:
    3,020
    Which one of the 12ft bigwaters did you go with Dave?I got some advice off Flathunter(Jack).He does a lot of distance casting on the river.They come in 12H and 12XH.He warned me to go with the XH,he said the 12H was kind of whippy.It feels like the 12XH will handle at least 16ozs pretty easy.I.ve done some casting with it last year and 8ozs will barely load it up.
     
  16. alton

    alton New Member

    Messages:
    1,045
    State:
    Illinois
    I originally had the 12H because it was the only 12' casting rod Bass Pro had in stock. I quickly returned it and had them order the 12XH. I just did not like the feel of the 12H or the 12XH. As I said, this was a couple of years ago, maybe if I tried one again, it may be a different story. Maybe my expectations at that time were a too high. Good luck.