Wasting fish

Discussion in 'Carp Fishing' started by dreamcatcher, May 30, 2006.

  1. dreamcatcher

    dreamcatcher New Member

    Hey guys, I had a conversation with Don Lambert over the weekend about a carp spearing contest they were holding outside the Bay City area. Don can give you better details because he saw it first hand, but what he told me just isn't right. They were filling up 55 gallon drums with carp, dogfish,(and a few catfish bit the dust). I guess the contest was built around who could get the most weight?!?! The prize money was a couple hundred bucks, and afterwards these fish are just thrown out to rot!!!!

    Now, I realize that many of us view carp as a "trash" fish, with much of this sentiment coming from the propoganda that surrounds other "more prized" species.

    THESE FISH ARE NOT TRASH!!!! Here's a couple of reasons why:

    (1) Although carp is an undesirable on the dinner plate in this country they maintain delicacy status in many countries around the world. Now ask yourself why this is the case. Do you think carp have achieved this status because of their bad taste? The taste of the flesh is not an acquired one, it is a taste that you should acquire. Don't fall prey to all this talk about a "mud vein." As brother Sparky would state, "There is no real magic about cleaning this fish." Cut away the reddish, brown meat from the top layer, and go about your business in preparing it like anything else. If you type "carp recipes" you will get many sites that give you different ways that you can prepare the fish...Don't fall prey to this propoganda!!! Carp is not only good to eat, but it's good for you. Some studies have shown that it's even better for you than catfish, for those of you that eat cats. It carries a little more fat than a cat, but it's higher in protein if I'm not mistaken. In these trying economic times you can't fall prey to heresay. Don't dismiss a valuable food source if you haven't personally tried it.

    (2) The sporting quality of this fish on light to medium tackle is second to none!!! Why would you spear them when you can test your angling skills in an attempt to catch a monster carp on a #2, 4, or 6 hook? Carp are some of the smartest fish in freshwater, so landing a real trophy carp on rod and reel is no easy task. You would have better luck landing a monster cat in comparison. However, anybody can spear a fish that's swimming just below the surface in shallow water. Let me fair here in regards to the spearing if that's your flavor. If you're going to make good use of the fish, spear it. That's as fair as I can get...

    (3) Lastly, if you don't want to eat it or target them on rod and reel, spear the fish and use it as cutbait for catfish. They bleed profusely, produce more oil than a bluegill, and they give you larger chunks of flesh to put on your hook. CATFISH LOVE CUT OR LIVE CARP.

    What am I missing? I just can't see filling up barrels of fish just to let them rot. What is the value in that?

    Does this type of activity go on where you live? If so, what is the reasoning that supports these events? Please give me a counter argument, because I'm not seeing the big picture here...
    __________________
    "With great power comes great responsibility." - Uncle Ben
     
  2. Cherokee

    Cherokee New Member

    Messages:
    1,743
    State:
    Salyersville,Ke
    I love catching carp with rod an reel.IF I turn them alose unless someone will take them and eat them. tks for the post bro.
     

  3. Deltalover

    Deltalover New Member

    Messages:
    1,227
    State:
    Tracy Calif
    I find people who kill just for the sake of killing, anything, completely repulsive!
     
  4. Taliesin

    Taliesin New Member

    Messages:
    680
    State:
    Missouri
    I have to agree with you here. The only time I have taken fish and killed them without taking them home to eat was when the pond owner requested it (bluegill and/or bullhead were taking over completely and needed to have their numbers reduced). Other than that it is just a total waste. The worst one I saw was a 4' spoonbill that was thrown up on the bank to rot.
     
  5. dreamcatcher

    dreamcatcher New Member

  6. metalman

    metalman Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,447
    State:
    IN
    Name:
    Winston
    Vic,
    I.M.H.O. there is no big picture. There is no counter argument. The reasoning (or reason) that supports events like this is that there is an awful lot of stupid around...W
     
  7. Gator

    Gator New Member

    Messages:
    1,116
    State:
    Ludowici GA
    I see no reason for this and think the people behind such a even need to be put in jail. Maybe we need to ask PETA to look into this one....
     
  8. flathunter

    flathunter New Member

    Messages:
    5,723
    State:
    Ohio
    I look at that as the same as bowfishing, useless slaughter.
     
  9. PapaBear6801

    PapaBear6801 New Member

    Messages:
    20
    State:
    Indiana
    This is the kind of thing that gets under my skin. I'm having a hard time even catching fish this year, and here are these people out there butchering and wasting fish.
     
  10. dreamcatcher

    dreamcatcher New Member

    You know I thought about that Jim, but dealing with Peta is like standing on the slope awaiting an avalanche. They'll pick up the perps, but they'll also pick up folks like me who approach fishing the right way. Get this: the DNR was on site for this event. That is the part that bothers me most of all. There is a reg that prohibits me from fishing with three or more fishing rods, but you can stand by and watch hundreds of fish get slaughtered? What, pray tell is the justice in that?

    I was kind of hoping somebody would pop in here and say carp are carrying the Aids virus or something of that magnitude...
     
  11. John H

    John H New Member

    Messages:
    24
    State:
    KANSAS
    GREAT POST - It's a shame that the event even happened. Reminds me while I was living in Georgia a few years ago. Several of the counties had dumpsters placed in the rural areas for the farmers trash. During deer hunting season, I found the dumpsters packed with deer... Just the head had been removed... It make's this old man sick.... There are so many folk's out there that have trouble putting food on the table and things like this happen. Mother Nature has ways of getting back and in some cases the sooner the better. I have a recipe for smoked carp that would have folk's beating the door down for... It involves smoked hickory and a lot of good old brown sugar..
    GREAT POST

    stay afloat and safe

    John H
     
  12. dreamcatcher

    dreamcatcher New Member

    Please share. I'm certainly interested...
     
  13. Gator

    Gator New Member

    Messages:
    1,116
    State:
    Ludowici GA
    Smoked carp is very good and I would love to get my hands on some that is for sure. Vic maybe if we wrote the governor that would help put an end to that type of waste I know I for one would be happy to write him and voice my displeasure with this type of event.
     
  14. astutzman

    astutzman New Member

    Messages:
    243
    State:
    Collinsville, IL
    Are these carp asian carp maybe? Invasives? The only justification that I can see is if the fish are more detrimental to the environment than they are useful as a food source.

    Even if that is the case, it's no reason to let them rot. Even if they're not being eaten, they can be turned into something useful, like fertilizer.
     
  15. dreamcatcher

    dreamcatcher New Member

    Jim, I'm seriously going to look into a similar course of action, but I want to give the DNR a piece of my mind first...
     
  16. derbycitycatman

    derbycitycatman Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    5,296
    State:
    Kentucky
    Im with ya on this one. I have no problems how they took the fish just use them after you shoot them. Even if its just for bait or fertilizer, just use them. This type of thing gives all sportsmen a bad image.
     
  17. dreamcatcher

    dreamcatcher New Member

    No, these are the common carp that were introduced way back when...the problem here is disillusionment. If the value of the fish in people's minds was on the same order as say, a walleye we wouldn't be even talking about using them for fertilizer. What's lacking here is education, pure and simple. What's even more ironic is the fact that I grew up eating the fish, and it was generally accepted in my community as great table fare. That same community nowadays won't eat it because of what they've heard. What a shame...

    I'm getting ready to contact the DNR, and get back to you folks...
     
  18. griz

    griz Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,744
    State:
    Murray Ky.
    Found this while researching carp spearing.
    "We eventually switched to Bass fishing, and Carp have become a nuisance, ruining the bass breeding grounds. Now they have Carp shoots in the Thumb, where archers slaughter the carp by the tons and dump the carnage as fertilizer on the local farms."
    This could explain why they have them and also might be what was being done with the fish afterwards.
    If no one is fishing for and keeping carp they can take over a body of water, this contest maybe the states way of controlling the carp population.
     
  19. dreamcatcher

    dreamcatcher New Member

    Good post Griz.

    Let me add some more information that supports the above quote. I just recently spoke to a fisheries biologist out of the Bay City office regarding these carp kills. In a nutshell, the fish out of the Saginaw Bay area contain high levels of PCB. Carp carry the highest level of these chemicals because of the fat they possess. The safe limit for PCB consumption is 2 parts per million(don't ask me to break that down in layman's terms). Carp supposedly exceed this limit by far, hence the abstinence for using it as a possible food soure. That was never a consideration anyway, because most people in the country prefer not to eat carp. This leaves one other option, which is not an option really, and that is to use it as fertilizer. The only thing that accomplishes is ingesting the chemicals in some fruit or vegetable form, unless the science states that the chemicals are synthesized in some way from the decomposed fish to the ripened crop. What do you say about this Kelly? You're the cell man here. In light of that fact, the biologist told me that the final resting place for a large portion of these fish are on someone's dump site. This is quite the dilemma, because the real answer rest not in the fish itself, but the contamination of the waters. That's another battle in itself, and the one that must be fought first...

    The guy that I spoke to was very helpful with his information, and gave me a little history lesson on carp introduction. According to him, these fish were introduced to the United States in the 1800's to provide a cheap food source that was high in protein. This importing was a movement that was heavily backed by the politicians on Capitol Hill. These congressmen were involved in the transportation of these fish all over the country, so the breeding process could begin in earnest, and boy did it take off! In his words, carp make rabbits appear celibate in comparison! You all may know that one female can lay up to 3 million eggs, so his stance was that I shouldn't worry about what the archers take out of the waters. In those days, there was a favorable market for the new species, especially in the Jewish community. The funny thing about that is we already had a high protein food source here with the catfish, but catfish then was not the market giant it is today. The Jewish community eventually turned away from carp as a viable choice , and opted for whitefish instead. Once this happened, a once burgeoning market began to wane, and carp is where it is today - shunned by many, and only desirable to a very small niche market.

    He did confirm my take that carp is a valuable food source, but you should check your local advisories for consumption levels. One to two pound carp are the most desirable for eating if you can find them in that size. As I informed him there is an education process that needs to start with these fish, because people need to stop killing them with extreme prejudice. The sad part about the fish kill is that the sentiment passes on to waters where the consumption is safe, which is where my soapbox is located. He told me that he enjoyed the conversation because not many people call him concerning the carp/catfish/dogfish population, but instead are swamping him with walleye questions. He also said that the fish kills have been going on since before he could remember, and that is the way the fishing laws have been since 1929.

    "The way it's always been" my favorite cop-out phrase...:0a13:

    What are your thoughts?
     
  20. metalman

    metalman Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,447
    State:
    IN
    Name:
    Winston
    Vic,
    As you know the carp started it's journey here from the far east. That can only mean that blood being thicker than water there has been a plot uncovered by those in power that shows these subversive fish plan to overthrow the country, perhaps by speading the bird flu or maybe they are sending maps of our waterways to Bin Laden.
    Seriously Vic, like I said before there is no really valid reason for this kind of thing.
    I would be interested to know what the mood at this event was like. I'll bet it wasn't quiet and workmanlike as it would be if they were doing a cull, I would venture to guess that it was more like a feeding frenzy or the scene from Lord Of The Flies when they kill the pig.
    "Kill the Carp, cut his throat, spill his blood.
    Makes one proud to be human, the most evolved species...W