Upside of dikes

Discussion in 'MISSOURI RIVERS TALK' started by cathunter26, Sep 27, 2007.

  1. cathunter26

    cathunter26 New Member

    Messages:
    34
    State:
    columbia, mo
    Whne fishing the upstream portion of a dike should I stay more to the end of the dike or does it matter. I assume any cover along the dike would be a good spot to start but other than that any help and also are there any dikes that seem to produce better than others? thanks alot
     
  2. Vince Copple

    Vince Copple New Member

    Messages:
    765
    State:
    Missouri
    Every dike or wing dam is somewhat different as this depends on the height of the water conditions at the time. Ive caught fish 3 feet from bank on the upsides due to the slack water there the baitfish might be at. There might be a ledge from the silt that cuts across. Normally, I anchor about 2/3 out from the shore and 150 to 200 feet up from it. Put a spread of your poles starting on the bank all the way across it. Depending upon if the water is rolling over the top or around it, then the baits will usually walk outwards. This way you will have to just let them drift thus covering more area. It will be like playing musical chairs with your poles moving them.
     

  3. Cuz

    Cuz New Member

    Messages:
    7,241
    State:
    DeSoto, MO
    Try fishing the current seam at the end of the dyke. You'll find the active fish sitting right on that current rip. If you can find a dyke on the upstream side where the current hits the middle and goes BOTH directions, thats PAY DIRT. Cast a couple rigs right in that current seam and let them fan out on both current rips like Vince described.
     
  4. turtle1173

    turtle1173 Member

    Messages:
    613
    State:
    Mayfield, KY
    You got to love those upstream sides!! You really just have to experiment as to which dikes are better. Some will be shallow. Some will be real deep. Some will have a sort of trough. Others will have some structure. Others won't have much. Trial and error... I've also caught good fish on some that fall under the category of "not having much" too.

    The upstream side has put a 42, 51, and a 71 in the boat this year. Also a couple 30's and a 20 lb Flatty.

    I fish them pretty similar to what Vince said. I let the current dictate how far out I anchor. I don't like to sit on the upstream side when it's ripping at the tip. I'll move farther in when that's the case.

    My 2 1/2 cents.
     
  5. Vince Copple

    Vince Copple New Member

    Messages:
    765
    State:
    Missouri
    To continue with now is the boat set up. I will use two anchors. Kinda hard now since Cuz has my good back anchor.. This is also why you want your main to be bigger to hold the boat and your back lighter to drag in all the time setting the boat. The first one being set up as the main ending up off the bow 50 or so feet off the front. Right when you drop that anchor, swing the boat right into the shore so you can drop your next back anchor towards the shore. This will give you about a 25 to 30 degree boat angle with the back of the boat pointing and staying in. There is a reason for this. Your partner in the back of the boat is responsible for fishing the shore line and the corner to 1/4th of the wing dam. Now your boat is cocked and you can fish the rest of the dike from the side of the boat. This gives you more boat area to walk and cover with those drifting poles that I like to do.
    To thoroughly work the hole you start at the top. For those who like to chum, this is the best approach to start here as your chum will drift down over the hole as you set up for your next positions. I’m going for the aggressive fish up in that top corner is why I start out here also. 25 or 30 minutes rolls by, then I will fire up the engine and go get the back anchor and swing out the other way and throw it again out from the shore. Have your partner up in front pulling in the rope as not to get it caught in the prop is very good advice!! Then he can let down more rope from the front and you are sitting in where Cuz is. Meanwhile, you have already started to scent the whole hole for moving below it next. Get out your heavy current poles and hit the rip and a 3 way rig to stick at the front of the dam slot as you should have found it already.
     
  6. Malichi1970

    Malichi1970 New Member

    Messages:
    1,334
    State:
    Fenton, Missouri
    Hey Vince, I tried something like this a couple of weeks ago. Me and Deb fished the upside of a dyke that had some logs sticking out about midway from the bank to the tip probably 25 feet in front of the dyke itself. On this dyke the current was coming in pretty hard and rolling about 5-10 feet in front of the dyke. Do you focus on where the water is rolling back from the dyke or in front or closer to the dyke itself. We had some issues trying to let our lines drift because of the logs, but it looked like a good spot to fish.
     
  7. Vince Copple

    Vince Copple New Member

    Messages:
    765
    State:
    Missouri
    Actually both as you never know. Id try to stick one above and along side the logs/structure if possible. You guys get a chuckle out of all the poles and different variations that I use. You want your stick poles and your drift poles as you might end up using 8 pole set ups to cover the dike eventually as you move out to the heavy current and back behind it in the reverse current concept Ill get to here soon.
     
  8. SkipEye

    SkipEye Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    7,525
    State:
    Winfield, MO
    Name:
    Darryl
    Dumb question.

    Maybe the dikes on the open river sections are mostly exposed, I don't know?

    The dikes are submerged in the pools. It's still a bit confusing trying to determine exactly where the structure is.

    I usually fish the downstream side because it's easier to read.

    I know I need to concentrate on the upstream because thats where the 'active' feeding fish should supposedly be.

    Guess that wasn't a question was it?:confused2:
     
  9. BKS72

    BKS72 New Member

    Messages:
    3,361
    State:
    East of KC
    If the water level's right, Darryl, you can see the "curve" in the water as it comes off the submerged tip of the dyke. If it's really high, it's good and bad. Good, because while your snooping around there slowly it's probably deep enough you're not going to hit the dyke if you're a little to close to the bank. Bad, because like you say, it's more work to find just where you want to put your bait.

    What I usually do is start 100 yards or so from the dyke on the downstream side and motor slowly up the current seam, watching the sonar. A lot of times the deepest part of the hole a lot further downstream of the tip than you'd think.

    Keep watching your sonar and the dyke, remembering where the deepest part of the hole was and where the slope is coming up out of the hole on the upstream side. Once you're in relatively shallow water above the dyke, toss your anchor and let the current get you back to within comfortable casting distance of both the deepest part of the hole and the slope going down in it.

    If you're anchored out close above the tip of the dyke and your anchor does come loose, it's usually no big deal. The current is going AROUND the end of the dyke and it'll take your boat around the end of the dyke without hitting anything.

    I like Vince's technique but I usually just work the end of the dykes during the day and if I anchor very far in on the dyke, most of my bait seems to wash into the face of the dyke an snag.

    Good Luck!

    Branden
     
  10. camochris2

    camochris2 New Member

    Messages:
    329
    State:
    nebraska city nebraska
    so i fish the missour river so i should anchor out towards the end of the dike and up or what i am new at fishing the top side of these and i am confused about the hole thing so any thing you could tell me to help would be great i all most need a pic i gusse im just not getting it :confused2: me not to smart :big_smile:
     
  11. Malichi1970

    Malichi1970 New Member

    Messages:
    1,334
    State:
    Fenton, Missouri
    Well Chris, when I'm fishing the tips I usually anchor upstream of the dyke in line with where the current is flowing around the dyke maybe 100 feet or so. This way your in the direct current enough that the current will keep you relatively straight and you can cast down into the current. I'll start with one pole towards the tip of the dyke and then work the water boiling around it with my other poles. You may get hung up some casting into the boiling water, but that's where I've found the fish to be feeding. I know this thread is about fishing the upside of the dyke, but I also fish below it in the same way as I described above. I'll anchor just inside the tip of the dyke drop one line straight down off the boat and then cast out into the boil on the inside part.
     
  12. Vince Copple

    Vince Copple New Member

    Messages:
    765
    State:
    Missouri
    Right behind the wing dam, you will find a reverse current during certain water levels. You will be anchoring below the wing dam and fishing upriver where this water swirls in a tornado effect back against the shore. There will normally be another hole by the shore that will hold the bait fish. There are several tackle techniques used. One using a no roll sinker to hold the current along the shore line on your inner poles and another outsides letting a roll sinker that will sweep in the current along the dam and down into the scour hole.. Another is to use live bait without much weight and let it swim naturally back up river, across the dam and then back into the rip. These are a few styles used to sweep below the wing dam.
     
  13. SkipEye

    SkipEye Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    7,525
    State:
    Winfield, MO
    Name:
    Darryl
    Well I'm just too stupid to fish because I am having a hard time figuring out who is saying what?

    I do know the scour holes can be where you least expect them to be. I get snagged a lot trying to fish the upside, or the current is ripping so fast that it takes the bait out to the tip and around anyway, well, I normally get snagged before that point though.

    The dikes are deeply submerged where I fish so by the time you see the disturbance on the water who knows where the structure actually is. I mean I can find it and all by fooling around then I lose my reference.

    I think the people who say they fish the top of the hole, then the left side of the hole, then the right side of the hole, then the middle of the hole, then just a little to the side etc. are full of p@@p!:0a36:Especially in all that current. I am half the time wondering if my bait is even in the hole period by the time it gets to the bottom. LMAO:smile2::smile2::smile2:


    Okay..... I am an idiot.:tounge_out::tounge_out::tounge_out: I just need a little hands-on instruction.
     
  14. duckalot

    duckalot Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,971
    State:
    Missouri
    All this talk make me ready to hit the water. Hey I know some of you are talented enough to put together a sketch or a drawing as to what you are describing. I get what you are saying but it would be neat to see a diagram of a wing dike and how you like to fish it.
    Thanks:wink:
     
  15. Vince Copple

    Vince Copple New Member

    Messages:
    765
    State:
    Missouri
    Sorry Rob.. I cant even draw a stickman that well.. The only way to really learn is experience and getting out there. Use your imagination of how the water flows as putting on a bobber will show you much of this. Pay certain attention to how the water is swirling. WIll there be a drop there that looks calm with waves behind it? Do and where do the swirls come together that are spinning in opposite directions.. Run over it with your boat and take a look what is there on your scanner if in doubt until you can get that mental image.

    It would be really cool one day to come out with a film that will show much of this. There are many ways of fishing the dam as I wanted to give some detail of a few here. Then again, you can throw everything you have at em and they still wont bite like the other day I was out.
     
  16. BKS72

    BKS72 New Member

    Messages:
    3,361
    State:
    East of KC
    Attached is a VERY BAD picture done in MS Paint kind of showing what I was trying to explain earlier. The lighter blue areas are the current seams/swirl and the light blue arrows indicate the back eddies and currents around the dykes.

    Big black spots indicate scour holes.

    Red block is the boat and typical bait placements. The boat placement is the way I would anchor, I've never tried what Vince describes, but it sounds like a great way to cover the entire area around a dyke.

    All along the current side of the face can be productive. If you'll notice, I'm showing one bait clear down in the scour hole off the tip and another closer to the boat on the slope coming out of the scour hole, as active fish will hang out on that slope waiting for lunch to come by.

    As you've figured out from the replies, everybody fishes them a bit differently depending on past successes and boat handling/bait presentation abilities. Sorry the picture is so crappy, but hopefully it gives a description of what we're talking about. Good Luck!
     

    Attached Files:

  17. SkipEye

    SkipEye Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    7,525
    State:
    Winfield, MO
    Name:
    Darryl
    Thats actually a pretty good pic Branden. But you can normally see the dikes exposed on the Missouri and lower Mississippi right?

    Guess I have had a harder time figuring it out because you can't see any of the dike, only by sonar and/or reading the surface disturbance.

    I need to go practice some more but I have things to wrap up before I leave town.:sad2:
     
  18. rodenberg

    rodenberg New Member

    Messages:
    121
    State:
    missouri
    is fishing the dike like this productive at night also or just the daytime
     
  19. brad kilpatrick

    brad kilpatrick New Member

    Messages:
    2,666
    State:
    Kansas City
    shoot Branden your a regular piccaso!!!! that is beautiful!!!!!:wink:

    i don't know about the rest of the fellas but i see right what your talkin about.
     
  20. BKS72

    BKS72 New Member

    Messages:
    3,361
    State:
    East of KC
    Darryl, yes, most of the time we can see the majority of the dike on the MO. I LOVE my side image for when the river's up and most of them are submerged because I can stay further to the current side of them and use the side-image to see the submerged end of the dyke.

    When it's up, it's probably similar what you're talking about on the Miss where you're limited to watching the current and the sonar. Still not too bad, but I'm sure it's a different game where you fish due to the much deeper water (which probably causes different current and hole/bottom patterns) on the Miss.

    Sounds like you're on the right track, lots of sonar time and you'll have them figured out pretty quick.

    Good Luck!

    Branden