Okay you guys wanted to see them here they are. I hope you get the jest of it. If not drop me a PM and I'll try to explain. I've seen them with PVC, inner tube's and all that other good stuff. I'll put mine up against any of the other style's. I caught a 6 lber on one of these and all it did was crack the pole. And it was in the middle of the blue river at the end of a sandbar. Not tied off to anything.