ply floor replacement (basstracker runabout)

Discussion in 'Boat Modification Journal' started by drpepper, May 19, 2008.

  1. drpepper

    drpepper New Member

    Messages:
    6,133
    State:
    Indiana
    Well, I built my carbs, new switchbox, waterpump housingin and imopeller, stator/alt. so I figured I'd do a complete rewire and the floor was "rrigged" by some yay-hoo and rotten, so here's some pics of a rip-out and replacement of a runabouts floor and carpet.
     

    Attached Files:

  2. drpepper

    drpepper New Member

    Messages:
    6,133
    State:
    Indiana
    heres summore pics
     

  3. drpepper

    drpepper New Member

    Messages:
    6,133
    State:
    Indiana
    well the other pics didnt "take" so lemme try again... later
     
  4. drpepper

    drpepper New Member

    Messages:
    6,133
    State:
    Indiana
    well I got 51, 52 and 53 to take this time..won't upload 47, 48 and 49 for some strange reason
     

    Attached Files:

  5. drpepper

    drpepper New Member

    Messages:
    6,133
    State:
    Indiana
    and heeeeeere's more
     

    Attached Files:

  6. drpepper

    drpepper New Member

    Messages:
    6,133
    State:
    Indiana
    a few more (only two left now!)
     

    Attached Files:

  7. drpepper

    drpepper New Member

    Messages:
    6,133
    State:
    Indiana
    last two In post the others in about a week when it's done
     

    Attached Files:

  8. drpepper

    drpepper New Member

    Messages:
    6,133
    State:
    Indiana
    Anybody think I should replace the styrofoam that was between the aluminum rail braces on the floor? It rotted and crumbled like the floor anyway and it really just traps water/moister between the wood and the foam and if the boats gonna sink, I just don't see how it would do much to keep it a-float anyway... what do you all think? leave it out or replace it? any other Ideas while I'm butt deep into this?
     
  9. AwShucks

    AwShucks New Member

    Messages:
    4,532
    State:
    Guthrie, Oklaho
    Definetley replace the foam. Your life is worth a lot more than the few bucks you would save. And, it may not be you in the boat at the time it decides to go under. If there was a fatality, and the investigators determined you didn't replace the foam, look out. Looks like that floor was an add-on in the first place. Take your time, use the right material, and don't scrimp to save a buck. Make it last.
     
  10. drpepper

    drpepper New Member

    Messages:
    6,133
    State:
    Indiana
    yeah the floor was in different sized cuts-pieced together rotted and weak... The Idea of leaving the foam out was not to save money - god knows at this point the price of the styrofoam is moot... but the fact the the foam traps the moister between itself and the floor causes mold and rot no circulation between the floor and the foam at all or the foam and the aluminum except through the strakes. And besides, I'd bet money that a 4'x6'x3"s of foam would not keep THAT boat from sinking even for .5 second lol I don't know.....
     
  11. Koon

    Koon New Member

    Messages:
    167
    State:
    Oklahoma
    Liquid expanding foam works well... I've used this stuff quite a bit lately from inside pontoon logs to making fishing jugs.... love this stuff.

    http://www.uscomposites.com/foam.html
     
  12. drpepper

    drpepper New Member

    Messages:
    6,133
    State:
    Indiana
    well the bottom floor is down ready for carpet... there was quite a bit of rewiring to do behind the side panels... took me a bit to get this far, between a complete kitchen remodel and building a dam for my smaller pond... I've had some full days, no time to fish yet:cry:
     

    Attached Files:

  13. drpepper

    drpepper New Member

    Messages:
    6,133
    State:
    Indiana
    Two more pics (so what right? lol)
     

    Attached Files:

  14. anchorpuller

    anchorpuller New Member

    Messages:
    857
    State:
    North Caro
    That's looking great Bill. What are you going to use to seal the plywood?
     
  15. drpepper

    drpepper New Member

    Messages:
    6,133
    State:
    Indiana
    The ply is marine type "water-proof" treated stuff screwed down with stainless steel screws, then the glue is water proof and it's that same carpet they use in new boats so it oughta be good to go. I did the exact same thing using the same materials on another boat I had and never had a single problem... the last ya-hoo that tried to replace the floor, didnt realize water rots unprotected wood, and after looking at his "handy work" I'd bet he was lazy or missing a few marbles at least (probably both!) The boat was wired by a retard to say the least... a pooly place wire under the floor rubbed through the insulation and melted the styrofoam.... bare wires, poorly splice wires that are half @ssed taped up are eveywhere... I'll be workin' on that next.... Knew I should have just bought a new boat... and Bass tackers construction don't Impress me AT ALL! I have a 16' Bluefin.. now that's a quality built boat... no frills though!
     
  16. Mark J

    Mark J New Member

    Messages:
    9,407
    State:
    Four Oaks, NC
    If you used marine plywood let me warn you.
    Marine plywood is not treated with anything to prevent rot.
    Some of the most expensive marine plywood available is made from a tree that is very little in the way of rot resistant. Okoume Aka Gaboon is one of them. Meranti is not a true mahogany. It's little more then luan.
    If its an American made marine plywood like fir you are in the same boat (no pun intended). Fir checks bad. When it checks, it lets water in just like all the reat of the American plywoods. The only way to prevent checking is to laminate it with fiberglass cloth and epoxy.

    What makes marine plywood , marine plywood is the glue in the plies and the lack of voids in the plywood. It has nothing to do with rot prevention beyond the glue and the lack of voids.

    Marine plywood will rot quicker then plain ol southern yellow pine.

    What makes marine plywood last indefinately?
    Liquid gold. EPOXY.
    A gallon will be a plenty to do that boat 3 or 4 coats on all sides and edges.
     
  17. Mark J

    Mark J New Member

    Messages:
    9,407
    State:
    Four Oaks, NC
    I am a believer in expanding foam from a value stand point but I build boats.
    It adds to the value. When I sell its a feature.

    From a legal standpoint the only legal requirement for having foam is on the manufacturer end. By law some portion of the boat has to stay afloat for I think 16 hours. Some manufacturers go even further by key placing foam to make a boat even full of water stay upright.
    Once its in the end users hands there is no legal requirement for foam.

    An alternative to faom is sealed compartments.
    You can eggcrate the bilge and seal each portion of the crate to prevent water intrusion. If you hole the bottom you may have a chamber or two fill but the remaining chambers of air will keep it afloat. This is what ships rely on utilizing sealed bulkheads. The Titanic wouldn't have sunk had the doors been closed.
    Air is lighter then foam and the boat will actually float a bit higher with sealed compartments as opposed to foam.
     
  18. drpepper

    drpepper New Member

    Messages:
    6,133
    State:
    Indiana
    It actually was pressure treated ply (the green stuff) I just called it marine. Did you say that was okay? IT'S NOT TOO LATE YET! and also the glue is waterproof (it says anyway) what do ya think? ok or no?
    I'll take it up and redo it it if I really need to...THANKS!
     
  19. Mark J

    Mark J New Member

    Messages:
    9,407
    State:
    Four Oaks, NC
    Pressure treated has its problems too unfortunately.
    Depends on the pressure treated lumber.

    Some of it is treated with a solution containing copper.
    It's advisable to put something inbetween the wood and aluminum to prevent electrolysis.
    2 dissimilar metals in contact with each other will eat each other.
    Anytime you deal with aluminum in particular you have to be careful with what everything is made of down to a screw if its in contact with the aluminum. I dont think the contact of the wood with aluminum is the largest problem. My thinking is what leaches out of the wood through wet/dry cycles would be the bigger problem.
    I have no real life experience with treated wood in contact with aluminum and its effects over a certain time span. If the boat will last 30 years thats one thing, but if it will last 5 years because of it then thats something else entirely. Thats an unknown to me.

    If it were mine I would use a regular grade exterior plywood. Pine is whats available here.
    I would coat all surfaces with 3 or 4 coats of epoxy and then lay six ounce cloth on the top side of all the wood panels.

    I just bought 10 yards by 50" wide 6 oz cloth for 50 bucks.
    A gallon of epoxy will run 75 -140 a gallon depending on brand.
    The cloth will prevent the wood from checking.
    The glassing is simple especially with a 6 oz. cloth.

    Ever seen a piece of weathered plywood with the cracks in it?
    Thats checking. Once it checks it's open to the elements. Youl loose the plywood layer by layer eventually.

    If I used treated I would leave the bottom un epoxied being that its installed and the moisture content is not known. I would however epoxy the topside and glass it to prevent checking. This allows moisture to leave the plywood from the unsealed bottom but prevents moisture from entering the sealed topside. If the wood is still real wet from treating, epoxy will not bond real well.

    If I were going to use treated from the git go I would buy early and rack it up to dry out for several months then epoxy the whole nine yards.
    It's real hard to find treated plywood that is dry enough to epoxy.
    It's treated in a vat under extreme pressure. Like pressure cooking.
    By the time you pull it off the shelf it's still full of water.

    The treated will last quite a while as is. The main reason I would seal atleast the topside is to keep it from soaking water and water vapors making it heavier.
    A typical sheet of treat pine 3/4" thick weighs around 82 pounds.
    Same thing in untreated will shave a good 20 pounds off that.
     
  20. anchorpuller

    anchorpuller New Member

    Messages:
    857
    State:
    North Caro
    Pepper,

    I don't claim ANY of the expertise in this area. I just recently did some work on my own boat, though. A friend of mine that used to build boats for Correct Craft/ Ski Nautique told me this... It's fairly inexpensive and said that is how they treated all of the wood in thiers.
    If I had put that much work into a boat, I'd treat it.

    Get a quart of fiberglass/polyester resin, a quart of acetone and the appropriate catalyst/hardener. All available at lowes last time I checked. Pour about a half pint of resin and a half pint of acetone in a steel can and mix in slightly less than the recommended amount of hardener, and stir. The acetone thins the resin so it will get sucked waay back into the grain of the wood, make sure to apply lots to the edges as they are basically sponges. The smaller amount of hardener will give you more work time to apply before it hardens. If you want to save the brush, wash it in a separate can of clean acetone, shaking it as dry as possible after. I always used a china bristle brush, natural bristles and cheap, and pitched it when done. If you want a second coat, sand lightly and dont thin so much.

    Mark may know even better with using the cloth. This just sounds easier to me.
    Anyway.. good luck with your boat. It sure looks like a nice job!