Not fond of this MO supreme court ruling

Discussion in 'LOCAL MISSOURI TALK' started by hook'em, Nov 18, 2009.

  1. hook'em

    hook'em New Member

    Messages:
    128
    State:
    Winfield, MO
    JEFFERSON CITY -- The Missouri Supreme Court has upheld a law banning people from possessing a gun while intoxicated.

    The ruling allows the prosecution of a southeast Missouri man who was found unconscious in his house with a loaded gun. In 2006, John L. Richard threatened to shoot himself or to force police to do it after an argument with his wife. Richard then took an unknown amount of morphine and an antidepressant.

    Missouri law makes it illegal to possess or discharge a gun while intoxicated. There are exceptions for transporting unloaded guns or when the firearm is needed for self-defense.

    A trial judge ruled in 2008 that it is unconstitutional to bar intoxicated people from possessing a gun in their own homes. The Supreme Court reversed that decision Tuesday.


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    I certainly don't advocate taking drunk and playing with firearms, but I think this law violates our constitutional right to bear arms. I know under the definition of "in possession" in regards to a vehicle, if the gun is loaded and locked up in the toolbox in the back of your truck and you are over the legal limit of .08 you can be charged with a felony. I can only assume this same definition would apply to the above law which was in reference to an individual that was located inside his residence.

    So, if you keep a loaded pistola in your sock drawer for home protection and for some reason the laws feel the need to search your house while you just slammed a 6 pack, your butt could be hauled to the clink for a felony possession charge. If convicted, say good by to your guns and voting rights.

    hook'em
     
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2009
  2. Welder

    Welder New Member

    Messages:
    4,834
    State:
    Missouri
    The second amendment rights being chisled away again. Hope it gets overturned in Fed court or the next time it goes before the MO supreme court. They getting awfule loose in the term of possesion. So in the terms under the law you cant have a loaded firearm even in the house you reside in when intoxicated. Wow that would put 90% of law enforcment in violation during off duty hrs.
     

  3. Catfish Pursuit

    Catfish Pursuit New Member

    Messages:
    1,081
    State:
    Missouri
    Some things to be considered here. If you are at home, and not a criminal or problem person, and are intoxicated with a firearm in your house, there would be no reason to worry about being charged. There are specifics in that case that make it criminal and "possession" is the key word. Possession would mean within your reach and "readily capable of lethal use". The suspect in that case was intoxicated and possessed a firearm, and then caused a disturbance which resulted in law enforcement responding to deal with him. He then apparently took it even further by wanting to challenge law enforcement so they would kill him. Lots of circumstances there that make his case a whole lot different than hanging out drinking beer with a gun in your sock drawer. In your sock drawer, or anywhere else in your house is fine. Possession of illegal narcotics in a sock drawer is a different deal all together because it is an illegal substance to begin with. A legal firearm, loaded or not, is fine, even if you're intoxicated, just don't have it readily available. Hope this makes sense. Chris
     
  4. moriver

    moriver New Member

    Messages:
    416
    State:
    Missouri
    If the police have the go ahead to storm your house and they find you drunk with a gun you get what you got coming. Sounds like someone was doing something that got them in deep stuff. Dont be stupid and live with it. To those that keep guns in the sock drawer, closet, under the bed or what ever means of not secured, sorry. You get what you got. Dont bother replying with I live alone, no kids, I live in the sticks and never see people or whatever. Those of us that lock our stuff up so the kids cant get it and shoot their school mates or whatever our loosing our rights because some in the group dont know what SECURE is. Go to Walmart and get a safe if you cant get a Browning and if you need a gun at your bed get on E-Bay and get a little pistol safe that reads fingerprints to open. They have gotten really affordable as of late. If I had my wish it would be sweeping new laws relating to secure fire arms. If someone gets shot or killed with a gun that you own you should get part of the charge if its not secured. I have had it with "They stold guns from a family members house and shot up school" or "The gun found at the shooting was stolen" BS, lazy people that dont secure guns cause a bunch of our gun problems. People better start securing them or our government is going to do it for us. Dont by what I am saying? Set back and watch. I will compare the government to my dad I guess. Dad used to say "you fix it or I will and their will be no bitchin about my way if your way did not work". We better fix it or dont cry about how they fix it for us........................................
     
  5. fishingbuddy4

    fishingbuddy4 New Member

    Messages:
    1,564
    State:
    Warner Rob ga
    glad your never packing ha ha
     
  6. Motopro00

    Motopro00 New Member

    Messages:
    554
    State:
    Festus, Missouri
    There going to keep taking no matter what. It only take's one person and they change it for everyone. It will never be a perfect world and people will always find a way no matter how much regulations are placed on us. ALWAYS
     
  7. big cat matt

    big cat matt Member

    Messages:
    320
    State:
    mo,OSAGE ARM TRUMAN
    Moriver dont take this the wrong way please.But if some one steals out of anothers house the home owner is not the criminal.If someone stole your car and killed another person with it should you be responsible?

    The people that commit vicious crimes should have a hell of a lot stiffer punishment!!!!!!
     
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2009
  8. Catfish Pursuit

    Catfish Pursuit New Member

    Messages:
    1,081
    State:
    Missouri
    Haha Rob! You can bet I'm packing everywhere I go, just because you don't see it doesnt mean that its not there somewhere. BUT, if you see me drinking a beer, then you can bet that I'm NOT packing. I never carry if I'm drinking. As to people securing their weapons, I see no problem leaving a weapon unsecured in your own residence depending on the circumstances at your home/family. If someone breaks into your house and steals something from you, its not your fault and you can't be held accountable. The criminals that are doing the crime need to be held accountable, and they get way too many breaks as it is, trust me I see it every day. A gun in a safe next to your bed is pretty worthless. If someone enters your house with the intent to cause you harm, you will lose because even with a fingerprint reading safe, you are so far behind in the game at that point its really too late. Sorry if you're offended, but thats just reality. Its really the same as carrying a pistol in the holster with a full magazine but no round in the chamber. Looks great in movies when they get ready to go clear a building, rack the slide for effect, but when its game time and its shoot or be shot, its way too late to chamber a round and get it on with the bad guy. I guess you might be able to get a round chambered after you get shot once, but whats the point? Chris
     
  9. catman-j

    catman-j New Member

    Messages:
    1,020
    State:
    Eastern Nebr
    I don't see people losing their drivers license or car for being drunk. They only lose it when they drive drunk. If you're the slightest bit under the influence it should be a felony if you're carrying a loaded gun. It should also be a felony if you drive drunk and get in an accident.
     
  10. moriver

    moriver New Member

    Messages:
    416
    State:
    Missouri
    No problem Matt You Have a point but to answer your question you will have responsibility. The state raquires you carry coverage on that vehicle and if it is used to kill someone in this day and age you can bet your insurance will pay. My views are different and I fault knowone for not feeling the same but something has got to change. What we got now is not working clearly.
     
  11. josh long

    josh long New Member

    Messages:
    17
    State:
    Evansville, Illinois
    in Illinois, I asked a game warden not to long ago and he told me that it is legal to go hunting while intoxicated as long as you don't drive!
     
  12. moriver

    moriver New Member

    Messages:
    416
    State:
    Missouri
    Yes Yes the safe will never work. I should add that a little bio safe opens in a matter of seconds. 2 or 3 as listed actually. If 2 or 3 seconds is to long you have no business pulling a gun unless you live alone. I would say its a safe bet that all but a few of us have other people in the house. You better make time to evaluate for a few seconds or you will be going to a family members funeral. As an officer in Oak Grove your responce does make me scratch my dome a bit.
    Not mad but what we have now is not working.......The folks that use guns in crimes do need the screws put to them but all these guns are coming for someplace. I do see change and for me it is, if its in your house it better be secure. Vault, little safe or trigger lock secure.
     
  13. Catfish Pursuit

    Catfish Pursuit New Member

    Messages:
    1,081
    State:
    Missouri
    Im not an Officer in Oak Grove. I have been in a few shootings and can tell you that you have little to no time to react when it all happens. Training is a big issue also, to be good at surviving a life or death situation you have to train under high stress so when it does happen your mind knows exactly what has to be done without thinking. Agree, our system is not where it should be but thats not the fault of the public. As to shooting at a family member? Hmm. Here's the situation: You hear someone in your house, and nobody should be there. You have just woke up and are still trying to figure out what exactly is happening. While you are assessing the situation, your opponent knows exactly whats happening, and is well on his way to causing you harm, and is likely mentally prepared for it since he had the nerve to enter your house. You are now awake, and go for your fingerprint safe, as your suspect enters and now you are in a full blown confrontation. You have had little to no time to prepare. By prepare, I mean have your weapon in hand and ready, and have moved from your bed which is where the suspect expects you to be when he enters. He enters the room, you are in bed and have just fumbled around with your safe in the dark, because if you turn on a light then you have lost your night vision. You finally have your gun out of the safe, and now its on and your are behind in the fight. In the game of living you always have to train and be mentally prepared for the unexpected, so when it does happen, its not so bad. Chris
     
  14. catfishscotty

    catfishscotty Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    4,388
    State:
    mo
    people are safe from my guns

    now deer, turkey,, coyotes ,, bobcats ,, foxes ,, coons ect are fun as heck to shoot !!!!!!!!!!!

    got 2 guns in the truck right now nothin better then gravel roads and a
    4 x 4 !!!!!!! i mean gravel roads threw the fields of course nyuck nyuck nyuck lol :smile2::smile2:
    a few in the house with enough ammo to last a few years :wink:

    my brother bought me a new scope today that im itchin to get on my favorite rifle and test it out !!!!!!!!!!

    as far as the kids shooting in schools thats a dam shame indeed !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


    but i feel a some CEO S could use some lead poising theese days for sure !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    line them up in a field and shootem like prarie dogs ya know turn them into pink mist from a few hundred yards away and let the buzzards have a feast !!!!!!!!!!!

    times are changing for the worst thats for sure :angry::angry::angry:

    thankgoodness i reload and have a good stock pile is all i can say !!!!!!!!!

    pepper spray may be good but as MR.T said i pitty the fool that trys to brake into my house or vehicle well if im not to scarred and remember to take the safety off first lol ...

    I wanna hear a loud bang not a click :roll_eyes::smile2::wink:

    good post and good points tho !!!!!!

    its a crying shame its comming to this all over the country ..

    but the best rifle rest ever made was electric windows in 4x4 trucks ...
     
  15. Motopro00

    Motopro00 New Member

    Messages:
    554
    State:
    Festus, Missouri
    I agree. Same thing if you hear some one in the house and you go for your "safe" and it make's a big click when it opens. You just gave away your position. Then you have got to chamber a round? It make's noise and that's double trouble when the intruder is in the house know where you are. You just compromised your own safety. And what if all this happens after you just had some beers watching monday night football? You just broke the law?
     
  16. plainsman

    plainsman New Member Supporting Member

    Messages:
    7,187
    State:
    minnesota
    A guy was working on his motorcycle in the driveway one Saturday, had a few beers while doing it. A cop was on the corner running a radar speed trap, watching the guy work on his bike in the driveway on private property. Well, he then started it up and the cop came and gave his a ticket for DWI. Just for starting the bike.

    If someone got his guns in his house and locked up, they oughta be considered secure. Agreed, we gotta do something, but has anyone ever considered changing society? Personal responsibility, Integrity? People seem to be growing up like honesty and not taking whats not their own. Tresspassing, stealing, killing is all part of the breakdown of society. It won't get no better till folks take personal responsiblity for their actions. If ya ain't gonna get married, keep it zipped. Treat others fairly, dont' lie, cheat, steal, etc. If ya break it fix it or replace it. pay your bills, gotta raise our kids right, they might not like it now, but will in the future. The alternative is plain as day and getting more obvious everyday.
     
  17. theonecatfishbob

    theonecatfishbob New Member

    Messages:
    4,100
    State:
    Wright City, Missouri
    Tim is right. We have the laws on the books to deal with these people. But so many times they walk with a slap on the hand. We need to crack down and put the criminals where they belong. I know that would put a burden on our penal system. But if you dont enforce the laws then people will not obey them. As long as criminals know they will probably wind up with probation they are not worried about committing the crime. The gains are worth the risk.
    As for a loaded gun in the house. Everyone that knows me knows if you are gonna come to my house at 2 am you damn well better call ahead. If you are in my house at 2 am and I am not expecting you, you better pray I dont wake up. I wont hurt you, I will kill you. I live alone and I know you can knock on a window or door first if you are family or friend. I dont drink now. I believe you should not handle a weapon if you are drinking. If a cop comes to your house he SHOULD have a reason other than you are drinking and own a gun. I doubt it will come to just randomly picking people in their yard drinking a beer and going in the house to see if they have a loaded gun.
     
  18. moriver

    moriver New Member

    Messages:
    416
    State:
    Missouri
    Chris,

    Sorry, I saw Patrol Sargent and Oak Grove and just put it together. You have good points but we just see a little different on part of it and thats ok. I respect your views.

    Scotty you crack me up. Pepper spray,,,,,might work good in chili I guess. Reminds me of a deal I saw a while back. Is said to wear bells and carry pepper spray of you are in the bear woods. Black bear scat would have berry seeds and twigs in it and Grizzly scat would have bells in it and smell like peppers:eek:oooh::eek:oooh::eek:oooh:
     
  19. catwhisper

    catwhisper New Member

    Messages:
    456
    State:
    georgia
    we dont have to like it but dont drink and pack!
     
  20. catfishscotty

    catfishscotty Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    4,388
    State:
    mo
    ya i was just having a little humor to this touchy subject is all ..

    being from the sticks and hunting all my life it just amazzes me how some laws are theese days !!!!!!!!!!!

    2 of my best friends went to prison for 4 months over killing a few stray cats :angry::angry: not pets i said strays !!!!!!!!!! nobody would claim them so they got rid of them from trashing the house that was up for rent and empty 1 of them owned :angry::angry: thats messed up for sure even the lawyer told them they could have raped a child and just got a slap on the wrist with no prison time !!!!!!!!:angry::angry:

    its a messed up world we live in !!!!! but I will never change no matter what the stupid laws say about gun control :wink:

    ive never been arrested or in any kind of trouble !!! so i say punish the bad guys more like killem or treat them bad enough jail they wish some one would kill them !!!!!

    if ya steal from some body cut their dam hands off !!!!!

    if ya shoot somebody you need to be shot

    ect ect ect

    the bad guys and punks running the streets and doing harm and no good allready know prison is a cake walk even if they end up going !!!!!!

    makes me sick :angry::angry: !!!!!!

    im old school an eye for a eye and a tooth for a tooth !!!!!!!


    ok ok im getting myself all wound up again lol sorry for my rant but the laws today are not for the good people seems like