Jet, Mud Motor, or fish far from home?

Discussion in 'Boating' started by Bigfish18, Oct 22, 2006.

  1. Bigfish18

    Bigfish18 Member

    Messages:
    534
    State:
    Wichita, Kansas
    The problem I have is the Arkansas River in Wichita KS. The river has some decent flatheads in it and the only pressure is from bank fisherman. I have a 16ft modV with a 25hp outboard. I have used it several times on the Akansas River about 50miles further down stream. The river is bigger down there because it has swallowed 2 other rivers. Even in that area I have to get out and pull my boat to knee deep water in order to get going again. There is always enough water to float the boat, just not enough to use the outboard.

    Would a jet outboard or a mud motor solve my problem? If so, which one is my best choice?

    The river is always at least 8" deep at its shallowest, 99% sand, and my boat sits about 4" deep with a full load.

    Thanks
    Cody
     
  2. zappaf19

    zappaf19 New Member

    Messages:
    1,574
    State:
    Monticello,IN
    Mudbuddie would be the way to go in my humble opion.
    Bill
     

  3. KansasKatter

    KansasKatter New Member

    Messages:
    807
    State:
    Wichita Kansas
    Cody,

    I feel your pain brother! Same goes for the Walnut, it goes from one extreme to another so fast, and lots of rock bottoms! I am either going with a jet, or mud motor come spring. My wife made me a deal, if I can save enough money building the house, I can buy the motor of my choice. Now all I have to do is decide........:roll_eyes:
     
  4. loanwizard

    loanwizard Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,297
    State:
    Coshocton,
    I don't know anything about mud motors. I have a 40 Evinrude jet on the back of my 16 foot Landau Jon boat. With a jet you go full speed into the shallows. By nature it must be on plane and will freak out knowing passerby who will swear you're going to go aground. On plane it will go in less than 6 inches of water. I wouldn't be without one in the waters I ply.
     
  5. Bigfish18

    Bigfish18 Member

    Messages:
    534
    State:
    Wichita, Kansas
    Yea kansaskatter we both know this pain dont we. I would love to live near a big river but all my family is here.

    Loanwizard, would a river composed of sand cause any problems to a jet?

    Thanks
    Cody
     
  6. KansasKatter

    KansasKatter New Member

    Messages:
    807
    State:
    Wichita Kansas
    I have heard the sand eats up impellers big time on a jet. I am going after a mud motor, the one linked below. For a lot of reasons. One being it is a 4 stroke motor, very similar to a large lawn tractor, easy to work on and find parts for. No maintenance, and it looks pretty much bulletproof to me! I like the short tail rather than the long tail too! I am looking into the Kohler 25hp model.

    http://www.mudbuddy.com/HyperSport.htm
     
  7. Bigfish18

    Bigfish18 Member

    Messages:
    534
    State:
    Wichita, Kansas
    Ive been checking into the mud buddy hyper drive sport because it has neutral. Mud buddy also offers a console steering setup. I would really like to keep my stick steering setup so im not setting in the back of the boat.

    Cody
     
  8. Mr.T

    Mr.T Active Member

    Messages:
    2,554
    State:
    MO
  9. Bigfish18

    Bigfish18 Member

    Messages:
    534
    State:
    Wichita, Kansas
    Theres only two things I dont like about the riverpro boats. The price tag and they are to much like bass boats.

    Tracker had a boat called the 185jet that uses the same engine I think. I have a tracker though and I probly would never buy one again.

    Cody
     
  10. loanwizard

    loanwizard Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,297
    State:
    Coshocton,
    I don't know how much sand there is in your river. I do know that I used one in the Osage River below Bagnall Dam with one with no problem. Jet impellers come with 6-7 shims so that as they wear they can be adjusted. You also want to know how much sand is in the top 6 inches of water for once it is on plane that is where it is getting the water supply. One thing about a jet. It will go in 4 inches as long as it has got you on plane. If you try to begin in the riffle, you ain't going no where. Every motor has its positives and negatives. I'd like to see on of those mud motors, but a 35 isn't near enough motor for me. Heck, I wish mine was a 60/45 or even a 90/65..... Next boat is gonna have a 115! :wink:
     
  11. KansasKatter

    KansasKatter New Member

    Messages:
    807
    State:
    Wichita Kansas
    Shawn, the Arkansas is ALL sand, litterally. From what I have read and understand, a 50hp prop motor is equal to a 75hp jet, so maybe a smaller prop motor would get you where you would need to be?

    I really like the whole 4 stroke lawn mower type engine, either Briggs and Stratton, Honda, or Kohler. The fact I can take it to ANY small engine shop for anything I can't do myself is VERY nice.
     
  12. Bigfish18

    Bigfish18 Member

    Messages:
    534
    State:
    Wichita, Kansas
    Well guys I just talked to a mud motor guy and he said that the sand is terrible hard on the props. I guess I could buy new props but they are pricy.

    I was on the Mercury site looking at the powerplants used in riverpro boats and Mercury doesnt want you running in water shallower then 3ft.


    This is a hard one.
    Cody
     
  13. KansasKatter

    KansasKatter New Member

    Messages:
    807
    State:
    Wichita Kansas
    Cody,

    I am not to worried about the sand and props thing, I don't see how the sand could be that hard on the prop, unless you were just running the prop into about 3" of sand CONSTANTLY, otherwise, how much damage could it cause?

    I wonder if you took a prop and welded some edges on the "cutting" edge of the prop, like they do to strengthen chisels on a plow to make them last longer. I wonder if you could do that and still make the prop work. That way you could have one prop for the Arkansas, keep the edges "built up" as to keep it from wearing away the prop? It may not be as effecient, but it would sure make it last longer, you could switch props for other waters............:confused2:

    It works on saw blades, farm implements, trenchers, excavators, why not a prop??:confused2:
     
  14. riddleofsteel

    riddleofsteel New Member

    Messages:
    353
    State:
    NC
    Face it man.....sand is grit, abrasive, ect. If you want to motor in shallow water you are gonna pay sonner or later. Jets, and props on outboards also wear in sandy conditions.
    Mud motor props can be rewielded and recupped. Mud motor props aren't cheap but have you looked at outboard props lately? Not to mention the coast of a lower housing for an outboard.
    The conditions you described are made to order for a surface drive mud motor. They use them in big rock rivers like the Yukon, Snake, and the upper Missouri all the time. My suggestion is to go look at some motors and boat combos. You can't be the only guy boating on those waters. What do the other folks in your area use?
     
  15. KansasKatter

    KansasKatter New Member

    Messages:
    807
    State:
    Wichita Kansas
    LOL they fish from the bank, or out of canoes and kayaks.:big_smile: I am sold on the mud motor, and plan on getting one come spring.

    How about my question though, could you "beef up" the edges of the prop with some welds to make it stronger and wear longer? I realize you will lose some performance, but if you kept that one prop just for this application, and switched back under normal situations, I think it would work pretty well.

    How do they work in normal waters, such as lakes? I was thinking of keeping my outboard for the weekends at the lake, and use the mud motor for the river trips only. If they perform well on the lakes as well though, I will sell my outboard to help offset the cost.
     
  16. KansasKatter

    KansasKatter New Member

    Messages:
    807
    State:
    Wichita Kansas
  17. brad kilpatrick

    brad kilpatrick New Member

    Messages:
    2,666
    State:
    Kansas City
    From what I saw of the Mud Buddy props they look to be pretty tough. Your gonna have to run through a ton of sand before You do any considerable damage to one. $210-$240 seems like a bargan ,My SS prop for My 90 HP Merc was $300 And That was the cheapest one I could find.
     
  18. Bigfish18

    Bigfish18 Member

    Messages:
    534
    State:
    Wichita, Kansas
    It looks like im going to go with a mud motor. I would like to thank all of you that posted on this topic. Brad, I have read alot of your post and you know river fishin from what I can see. I recently went on a trip with the Catdaddy RR Shumway. We put in at Eudura, and the river was low from what Shumway said. At that flow the Arkansas is half as wide and half as deep. The Arkansas is almost identical to the Kansas. Just half the size.

    Thanks
    Cody
     
  19. brad kilpatrick

    brad kilpatrick New Member

    Messages:
    2,666
    State:
    Kansas City
    Cody,
    I've seen the arkansas river in Wichita, but I've never fished it. From what I've seen of the Arkansas The Mud motor will serve You well. Just like the Kaw but half her size.....sounds like Flathead heaven!!!! I wouldn't imagine the fishing pressure is all that great,plus its hard to navigate. With that mud motor sounds like Your gonna be a whole lot more mobile then most guys out there. With a little luck You should get into some monster flats this summer.

    Did you get into any fish when You went out with Catdaddy? I've met Him and He seems like a pretty good ole boy.

    I used to fish the Kaw for Flatheads all the time around the Desoto area. I now live in Kansas City Ks, minutes away from Kaw point. I Fish the Missouri River a bunch, and the Kaw when its up and running, targeting Big Blue Cats almost exclusivly.
     
  20. peewee williams

    peewee williams New Member

    Messages:
    3,111
    State:
    Pembroke,Georgia
    I have a 9 horse "Go-Devil."I got the 9 because 10 hp.and under is the State and Federal hp.limit on many of the areas that I fished.Shallow sandy water has caused very bad prop erosion with Stainless and aluminum props on all of my motors at times.The Go-Devil weedless prop erodes across the face of the blades as well as the edge like standard props do.You use to be able to get your props rebuilt as you suggested.They have to be done as you say by building up,with welding rods of various types.You can even use very hard materials for this.I have spent weeks at a time doing this to pump impellers and augers in a pulp mill.High speed impellers or propellers of any type have to be machined and balanced afterward.If not,they will vibrate and shake your motor apart.Being circular and the speed is where the balance problem arises.Also a hard surface will often break or shatter upon impact with a object.For years I use to have my props rebuilt at 1/2 the price of a new one at a place called Champion in Savannah Georgia.Wear,broken blades and bushings.They did it all.peewee