Is this a law?

Discussion in 'LOCAL INDIANA TALK' started by gargoil77, Jan 26, 2006.

  1. gargoil77

    gargoil77 New Member

    Messages:
    859
    State:
    Clarksville, Indiana
    "Minnows should not be released into the water after you finish fishing. Emptying bait buckets can contaminate a body of water with undesirable fish. Fishing worms should be discarded in trash containers."

    I read this in Indiana's rules and regulations. Does anyone know if this is a law or just a statement saying that this is what you should do? I have always emptied my worms and minnows in the water.
     
  2. metalman

    metalman Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,447
    State:
    IN
    Name:
    Winston
    Yes, it would seem to be a law (regulation).
    Although it says:

    "Minnows should not be released into the water after you finish fishing".
    which is not very regulatory in tone, it goes on to say:

    "No individual may take any live fish (native or nonnative) and release it into any other public waters without a stocking permit."
    which sounds very regulatory.

    I suppose you could argue that if you bought the minnows from the bait store you didn't exactly "take" them which I guess means catch them yourself but I think the wording is pretty much to the point...W
     

  3. Rat

    Rat New Member

    Messages:
    236
    State:
    Forrest Illinoi
    Most states either have laws or strongly worded suggestions about releasing live bait into waters when done fishing. For instance, have you ever got 2 dozen minnows at the baitshop and found out one of them isn't a minnow? Or had a snail in the bottom of your bucket? If you didn't notice, and threw your remaining bait into the water when done, you could possibly release an exotic or nuisance species into your favorite fishing hole. If I caught it there, I'll release it there. If not, it either goes home with me, or is disposed of.
    Rat
     
  4. Fishgeek

    Fishgeek Active Member

    Messages:
    1,149
    State:
    Indiana
    Good question Gargoil. never really thought about it much but Winston makes a good point. The "should not be released..." sure sounds like a strong suggestion instead of an actual rule...especially when the language for other regs. uses stronger language. For instance, in the preceeding sentence says "...taken from public cannot be of any species considered threatened or endangered." Then ifurther up in that section, "You cannot transport more than 100 crayfish across the state boundary..." From some of these other examples, the "should not" sure sounds like a suggestion. But, as Winston pointed out, there's the other section that actually is a rule that states you can't stock fish in public waters without a stocking permit. And as Winston implied, if you look at these two statements together then it certainly sounds like its law...because dumping your bait bucket in the river would be stocking without a permit. Kinda' vague, huh? I'll see if I can get a better answer from a CO.

    312 IAC 9-10-8 Fish stocking permits
    Authority: IC 14-22-2-6
    Affected: IC 14-22

    Sec. 8. (a) It is unlawful to stock fish unless a permit is obtained from the division under this section.
    (b) An application for a fish stocking permit shall include the following information:
    (1) Species and number of fish to be stocked.
    (2) Location of waters to be stocked.
    (3) Reasons for stocking.
    (4) Date of proposed stocking.
    (5) The source of the fish to be stocked.
    (Natural Resources Commission; 312 IAC 9-10-8; filed May 12, 1997, 10:00 a.m.: 20 IR 2730; readopted filed Jul 28, 2003, 12:00 p.m.: 27 IR 286)


    Gargiol: The first page of the Fishing Guide has a disclaimer that the guide is only a summary of Indiana fishing regs. The actual "law" can be found in the Indiana Administrative Code (http://www.state.in.us/legislative/iac/title312.html) Scroll down to ARTICLE 9. FISH AND WILDLIFE. Fishing regs start on about page 30-31. There was no wording in there to clear up the dumping bait issue.

    Not sure it that helped at all...just another opinion!
     
  5. flathunter

    flathunter New Member

    Messages:
    5,723
    State:
    Ohio
    I thinK Ohio law states the same thing..What rat says is dead on.
     
  6. gargoil77

    gargoil77 New Member

    Messages:
    859
    State:
    Clarksville, Indiana
    I rekon i won't be dumping any more minnows into the lakes. But the worms? I'll still feed the fish w/ anything left over as far as worms or beemoths. I can't understand that one.
    I appreciate everyones replies.
     
  7. zappaf19

    zappaf19 New Member

    Messages:
    1,574
    State:
    Monticello,IN
    I know alot of pond owners who say NO minnows. The problem is your minnow could be a carp or some fish they don't want in there pond. The worms tho throw me.:confused:
    Bill
     
  8. Fishgeek

    Fishgeek Active Member

    Messages:
    1,149
    State:
    Indiana
    I'm kinda' stumped on worms in the water too. However, I did read something awhile ago that Canadian Wigglers have been causing problems where released outside of their native range. I really don't remember the specifics so take this with a grain of salt....but, apparently these non-native nightcrawlers are very efficient at eating through organic matter on a forest floor -- much more efficient than native species. And, if I remember right, they eat through the stuff (leaves & other dead stuff on the forest floor) too fast and it messes up the nutrient cycles in the forest. Maybe I should google Canadian Wigglers & see if I can get some better info.
     
  9. gargoil77

    gargoil77 New Member

    Messages:
    859
    State:
    Clarksville, Indiana
    I don't think I've ever seen Canadian Wigglers for sale anywhere. What's the differance between them and regular crawlers?
     
  10. Fishgeek

    Fishgeek Active Member

    Messages:
    1,149
    State:
    Indiana
    Wal-Mart sells them. I'm not sure what the difference is but I guess there not native to our area (???)
     
  11. gargoil77

    gargoil77 New Member

    Messages:
    859
    State:
    Clarksville, Indiana
    I guess I should try them just to say I have.
     
  12. Fishgeek

    Fishgeek Active Member

    Messages:
    1,149
    State:
    Indiana
    OK, I just talked with a CO & asked him about the issue of dumping your bait bucket in public waters. It is NOT illegal. You do NOT need a permit. If you dump your bait bucket in the river you're not going to get arrested or ticketed. As someone stated earlier it is a strong suggestion...and a good idea. We do want to keep as many non-natives out of our waters as possible.
     
  13. gargoil77

    gargoil77 New Member

    Messages:
    859
    State:
    Clarksville, Indiana
    Thanks for the info Fishgeek.
     
  14. Fishgeek

    Fishgeek Active Member

    Messages:
    1,149
    State:
    Indiana
    No problem! Glad I could help out...& I learned something too!

    Have a great day!
     
  15. river scum

    river scum New Member

    Messages:
    3,474
    State:
    hooterville indiana
    IMO, it should be a law, to keep exotics out.
     
  16. Environmentor

    Environmentor New Member

    Messages:
    95
    State:
    Buffalo, Iowa
    Although I live in Iowa, and this question pertains to Indiana I just thought I would jump in, after all this "suggestion/law" is in most states. It is important to NOT dump your minnows (as some have stated) because you can release exotics. Wether it is law (I am sure it is, or someday will become, law in some states) I think it would really depend on the officer, sometimes you have officers who like to stretch the law. Even if it is not a law, you probably are breaking the law of "illegal stocking" if the officer really wants to push it. For example, we have these series of lakes around me (West Lake Park, and one is a no minnow lake - you will be in violation if you posess minnows on the lake) and another which originally had no gizzard shad. Now this "Main Lake" is full of gizzard shad from people dumping/illegaly stocking gizzard shad. The fishing has went way down hill in this lake with this invader. In Iowa only 75 bass fry are stocked per acre, and with minnows being prolific breeders and about the size of a bass fry, I think it would be safe to say you could stock minnows with about a dozen per acre. (Multiply this out amongst all the "uneducated" anglers dumping bait on a given lake and realize how many minnows are probably really entering that lake). Worse, if the officer found that you had dumped an exotic or perhaps tried dumping an exotic (if a dead one's on the surface, or he stopped you from dumping in the act) this carries a HUGE fine, but only if the officer wants to push it. Also, if some of you bait is dead the officer could get you with "littering" if he wants, if there is dead minnows when you dump it. Again, I think it depends on the officer's personality and beleifs. (However, if this is true then wouldn't dumping them on the bank - as suggested - be littering!)

    As far as worms go, it might be littering because most people have the habit of flinging dirt and all into the lake. Most of this "dirt" used by bait companies contains "other" stuff such as shredded paper, wood chips, styrofoam, moisture "holding" material, etc. So, you are throwing this stuff in the lake. In some states, it is illegal to put anything in the waters that aren't attached to your rod or boat (such as chum, egg shells, or whatever). Also, the soil could contain non-native (non-local or exotic) worms, soil bacteria, or other soil organisms that may have some adverse affects on the local ecosystem. (Again think about all the anglers on a lake in a year and all the bedding and worms that they throw in multiplied, how much foreign material and organisms are introduced to your favorite lake)

    Truthfully, I had dumped minnows before (however, now I bring them home and feed them to my aquarium fish/frogs) and I still typically feed the fish the worms if my bait is near dead or if I only have few left (however, I just throw the worms in with out the dirt) and if I have enough I take them home and keep them in the fridge (I always keep my worms in a cooler when fishing so they don't overheat).

    Protect the lake, dump the bait on the shore, I know some people may feel bad that they are just "killing" these minnows by "banking" them and feel they are giving them a fighting chance by being "released", and maybe "feeding" the fish and allowing them to get bigger. However, think of it as protecting the fish by not introducing these foreign invaders - think of it as your feeding the racoons (this is actually what you can tell children, who think it is wrong to bank/kill minnows).
     
  17. kspor

    kspor New Member

    Messages:
    716
    State:
    Wichita Kansas
    We have white perch in Kansas now. They were brought in with some white bass and now they are a real problem. Those innocent looking minnows may grow and reproduce. Imagine your favorite fishery ruined, but a new species. A recent report states that most saltwater fish caught in our harbors are not native. THe number was like 75% non native. Look at the snakehead fish. It was found in waters that all said it would not survive in. I say kill the bait and then throw it in or salt em down and use them next time.