Fair Chase: Fishing and Catching

Discussion in 'All Catfishing' started by wolfman, Feb 27, 2008.

  1. wolfman

    wolfman Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    9,081
    State:
    Triadelphia, WV
    Name:
    Walter Flack
    In this view, the catch is the exception and escape is the rule. Simply put, a chase is fair if the fish has a reasonable chance of escaping the pursuit unharmed. If the fish has little or no chance, the chase is not fair. Fair chase demands a balance of power between angler and target: the angler's ability to track, pursue, and acquire a trophy must not be greater than the trophy fish abilities to elude capture or death.
     
  2. Larry

    Larry New Member

    Messages:
    707
    State:
    Minnesota
    Interesting way to put it. I agree. It feels a little more rewarding when your goal is achieved after you've been playing the game for awhile.
    Tip of the Hat to Wolfman.
    thanks
    Larry
     

  3. jason454ci

    jason454ci Active Member

    Messages:
    1,307
    State:
    Zanesville, Ohi
    Very good view Walter. It makes the catch much more rewarding using that logic.
     
  4. JERMSQUIRM

    JERMSQUIRM New Member

    Messages:
    13,145
    State:
    il-waynesv
    nothing but snoopy poles 4lb line and biodegradable hooks for me in 08.lmao.

    good post walter.
     
  5. bownero

    bownero New Member

    Messages:
    3,137
    State:
    Hastings, Ne.
    rods, reels and bait. no dynomite!!! thanks 4 the post!! Well put!!:big_smile:
     
  6. peewee williams

    peewee williams New Member

    Messages:
    3,111
    State:
    Pembroke,Georgia
    I am hard core and nailed down against fair chase.It ain't no fun.

    When are you folks going to chop a hole in the ice and noodle naked in February,OR noodle naked in june with the Snappers and Cottonmouths in Georgia?You can actually catch and release in HONEST fair chase this way!Do any of you know a fairer way?

    Folks like me who buy line,hooks,sinkers,poles,rods.reels,boats,motors,fish finders,nets,bait and such do so to catch fish.None of this is purchased to give the fish any chance that we can eliminate.I am honest about it.Name the pieces of equipment you bought to help give the fish a chance!Beer don't count,though that is all that I know of that any use or have bought.

    If we were worth a crap at fishing,we would not think that we needed or even want all of this stuff.If we were any good,there would not be any fish left to catch.

    We take every advantage that the law and our finances allow and call it fair chase and sportsmanship.We chase a primitive creature with a primitive brain who operates on instinct.We often use equipment costing thousands of dollars and often weighing a ton or even tons to catch a fish.Anyone who calls this fair chase or sportsmanship will play Golf.After all,he has the same values,why not.Golf started out with homemade clubs and balls.A rough un mowed pasture stocked with mean cows,meaner bulls and all of their manure!Now a cripple like me can by the rules play Professionally!Not much of a game and they want to call it a sport.It is about as much a sport as fishing and hunting really is.

    Many of these often condemn the commercial fishermen,trot liners,set liners,noodlers and trappers as un sportsmanship.Well they are right.They are as or no less as the people complaining about them.What a joke!

    Many of us "Sportsmen look in a mirror,like what we see and think that the world should rotate to suit us.What is even worse.Some expect it,or act like they do.

    I have seen folk ridicule someone fishing with a beer can or cola bottle yet brag of their sportsmanship in using a $200.00 rig.

    Why is sportsmanship now interpreted to mean "catch all that you can with the money you have to spend doing it.

    I believe I was honest about it.I did it for food,money and recreation.I have yet to see fair chase or sportsmanship involved.Catch and release is still recreation.

    I for one am not and have never been a fair chase man other than listening to a dog run a fox or rabbit for fun.I hunted and fished with the best that I could afford to give ME all of the advantage that I could take and that I was allowed.I still do!

    If any have equipment that they bought and use to give the fish and game a better chance,please let me know.

    How can it be fair chase unless the fish and game have the same chance of survival that you have?Many on here can tell you that "fair chase"ain't fun.

    I wrote all of this in fun.Sadly,there is a lot of truth here.

    True fair chase is hunting Grizzly with just a dozen knives.

    Courting a woman is not fair chase because the man never had a chance!

    I love you Brothers and Sisters.peewee
     
  7. Dreadnaught

    Dreadnaught New Member

    Messages:
    5,444
    State:
    Henderson,Ky
    That's it!!!! PeeWee just gave me a great idea, LOL!!!

    I am gonna start fishing with a willer limb and kite string, using saftey pins for hooks and catch flies for bait, LOL!!!!!
    No Reels, it would be an unfair advantage, LMAO!!!
     
  8. firechief4201

    firechief4201 New Member

    Messages:
    1,055
    State:
    Catlettsburg, Kentucky
    There are members on this site that have spent years of there lives in learning all they can how to angle and catch this primitive brained instinct feeding fish that we don’t give a chance to.

    Fishing is a sport and any person that don’t think so don’t know what there talking about. A sport is a pastime, or contest that requires a reasonable amount of physical activity along with individual skill.

    Fishing is a sport that any person can do no matter there age, sex, or race. That makes a fisherman one of the best sportsman there are no matter what gear he or she uses.
     
  9. JAinSC

    JAinSC Active Member

    Messages:
    1,514
    State:
    South Carolina
    Good post - the whole fair chase concept brings up a lot of interesting questions. You know, I really do agree with Pee Wee. Most people that claim they are giving "fair chase" are fooling themselves.

    Like Pee Wee said, I do everything I can to stack the odds in my favor. I think we all do. I bleieve that the fish's more than reasonable chance of escaping the whole thing unharmned comes from their initial choice whether or not to take the bait. Once they take that bait, I am going to do all I can to get a solid hookset and get them into the boat. Now, after that they almost all go back into the river to hopefully come back and play with me again ond day.

    My quarrel with commercial fishermen has nothing to do with fair chase. It is an issue of resource allocation. Why do they get the right to take such a huge share of the rish? They are making private profit off a public resource just because so many people are either too lazy or too incompetent to go and catch their own fish. And, yes, I am about half serious there.

    In the field sport area, about the only true "fair chase" I believe in is the hunting of man-eating tigers or lions. I have read a few books by a man named Jim Corbet who hunted man-eating tigers in India. The tigers had the better senses and better knowledge of the surroundings. Each time he set off into the jungle, there was a very good chance that the tiger was hunting him, too, and you can bet that tiger would not release him at the end of the game!
     
  10. catfishcrazy256

    catfishcrazy256 New Member

    Messages:
    2,648
    State:
    Indiana
    there you go J.W. that might work LOL
     
  11. Mark J

    Mark J New Member

    Messages:
    9,407
    State:
    Four Oaks, NC
    How many of the fair chasers "sportsmen" trophy hunters, "conservationists", and CPR hounds are willing to make the commitment to never use another barbed hook for any species?

    If you are a proponet of CPR and do indeed intend to release, there is absolutely NO reason to use a barbed hook ever.
    Tournament fishing is no excuse for using barbed hooks . That is putting a price on the fish's head. In other words, money makes the decision of what damage you are willing to risk to the fish.
    Personally I would love to see ALL tournaments go barbless. Throw that in your fair chase bag.

    Now here is my take on fair chase.
    I fish to enjoy and enjoy to fish. I've done the tournament thing quite seriously when I was alot younger and dumber. Yea dumber. Aint nobody telling me I got to fish in a pouring down rain for 8 hours or fish in a sleet and have to bust ice off a boat ramp no more. Screw that. If I want to fish 16 hours and sleep 4 of those thats what I'll do. If I want to hook the home brew keg up to the onboard kegorator you'll see ol Mark sporting a Dixie cup ALL day long.
    Dont worry soapboxers. I have a DD. He gets paid real well to wear that captains hat too.

    I figured out fishing wasnt fun anymore when somebody told me when and where I had to fish and how long I could fish or how I had to fish.
    Sounds alot like work to me.
    We got the same kinda rules. When, where, how, and for how long.

    You take your beer can reel, your bush hooks, jugs, trotlines, your cane pole or your 800 dollar custom outfit and go fish and enjoy and may the fishing gods put a billy stick to the back of the head of every man trying to get in the way of your enjoyment. Thats exactly the way I look at it.

    I dont care if you like to noodle, net, trotline, rod and reel, bush hook , jug, or do indian fish dance's on the bank of the river. All I can ask of any man is to just respect it. Follow the laws, have a good time. Take what you'll eat large or small and dont forget to carry some fish to mama who made it all possible to begin with or uncle Marvin that loves to eat some fish but dont get around so well anymore.

    I just tied up some new leaders the other night and got them all on my leader board. Ohhhh they got mean jaw ripping barbs on those suckers.
    Oh? You thought I have something against barbs? Heck no. Only people that use them and tote around a soapbox to preach off of.

    However I do alot of barbless fishing in all species. I'm just not totally willing to commit to save the mouth and jaw of every fish including a trophy fish in my pursuits of enjoyment. I have caught trophies on hooks with flattened barbs and will catch more. Depends on where I wish.
    The main thing is I enjoy fishing. I'm going to make it as fun for me and my fishing partners as possible. Dont rain on our enjoyment.
    I try to stay out of other folks tacklebox.
     
  12. Dreadnaught

    Dreadnaught New Member

    Messages:
    5,444
    State:
    Henderson,Ky
    Mark, Mark, Mark, A soapbox is a soapbox no matter where you stand on it, LOL!!!!!!

    Though you did make some good points while you were standing on the one you have, LMAO!!!
     
  13. Mark J

    Mark J New Member

    Messages:
    9,407
    State:
    Four Oaks, NC
    The point JW is that fishing isnt a one way street.
    Many people love to fish and fish the way they enjoy fishing.
    Fair chase boils down to getting enjoyment out of fishing. Same difference in hunting. Is fair chase bow or rifle hunting? Depends on who you ask and what they are looking for in a hunt. Regardless whether with arrow or bullet, its for keeps.

    I dont see a thing wrong with tournament fishing or using a big ol hook with a big ol barb or sticking your arm up into a hole in the bank of a river.
    Each to his own. There was a point when I loved tournament fishing and there came a point I hated tournament fishing and there came a point I lost enjoyment of fishing.
    That was ME. We are people, not bots. I think competition is a good thing but competition shouldnt be a free pass that over rides the preaching.
    Preach all week, play on Saturday and spend Sunday repenting for Saturday.

    Just dont drag on your box and tell me how I am supposed to enjoy my fishing.

    Somewhere in there you have to begin to practice what you preach off these soapboxes or you need to step down to an ankle breaking coca cola crate with a tin can for a microphone.

    If you want to save these trophies ,save them with more then talk.
    Action speak louder then words. Make every effort to do so and leave no stone unturned and no path unexplored. Set the precedent. The rest will follow.

    How many tournament series allow the consumption of alcohol?
    Somebody set that precedent and others followed. They didnt preach it.
    They took action and lead by example.

    Everybody has their own tacklebox brother and its like an underwear drawer. For the wearer of the underwear.
    Underwear is not one size fits all. Some folks have more junk in the trunk then others.
     
  14. Grimpuppy

    Grimpuppy New Member

    Messages:
    3,556
    State:
    Concordia, KS
    I bought a rod once that gave the fish a better chance of "winning". Little did I know at the time that would be the case though. I don't have that rod anymore:wink:.

    Integrity is not doing the right thing, it is doing the right thing when no one is watching.
     
  15. john catfish young

    john catfish young New Member

    Messages:
    3,070
    State:
    Kentucky
    I think that releasing all fish over 10lb....is about as fair chase as I care to go.
     
  16. peewee williams

    peewee williams New Member

    Messages:
    3,111
    State:
    Pembroke,Georgia
    So?

    All you said is true and never once addresses sportsmanship.

    This is exactly what I talked about.

    I agree with you whole heartedly.What you said has nothing to do with and does nothing to show sportsmanship in any manner.Just the opposite.

    I have spent about 59 years being a sportsman and engaging in sports.The only times that I ever engaged in sportsmanship was with other humans in games some call sport.I never engaged or attempted to engage in sportsmanship with fish,game or man when in the military.I used every device that I could get to get a unfair advantage.

    Sportsmanship we just ain't got,don't want,ignore and get feisty long distance when the truth is pointed out to us.We would rather act stupid and act ignorant than look up the word sportsmanship and find out or admit that we "don't got it".


    I agree that you are a sportsman engaging in a sport.What is missing is "Sportsmanship".Spending years learning how to catch or kill better is not "Sportsmanship".Look up the words.I did.I do as you do but I do not bull manure myself or others about what I do.We are sportsman engaging in a sport with a complete disregard for sportsmanship.Every commercial fisherman and every lawful manner of taking fish,and game can be a sport done by a sportsman.Surely it is nothing to admire or brag about.Sportsmanship is.

    To practice one thing and claim another is dishonesty.Acceptance or denial of the truth is always up to each of us.

    I do find this willful and deliberate ignorance of the obvious by many comical.I ignored it for most of my life.

    Most actually cry and complain when a piece of equipment causes us to lose fish and game.

    I love you Brothers and Sisters.peewee
     
  17. skawez

    skawez Member

    Messages:
    720
    State:
    Hickman, Ne
    Name:
    Steve
    fair chase. can you actually combine those two and have it be truthful? no matter what the "game" or "species" is theres always some one or something that gives "us" some kind of advantage some how some where. its the elements and the surroundings that give "them" what edge they have. So "fair" chase is just a word that says we dont get'em everytime. but i have to say that "we" believe ourselves to be the superior species and to have the advantage.. if this is true... i want to see the mounted Big Foot and Lockness Monster.
     
  18. skawez

    skawez Member

    Messages:
    720
    State:
    Hickman, Ne
    Name:
    Steve
    Sportsmanship.

    Full commitment to participation

    Respect and concern for rules

    Respect and concern for social conventions .. shaking hands, recognizing the good performance of an opponent

    Respect and concern for the opponent .. not taking advantage of injured opponents

    Avoiding poor attitudes toward participation not adopting a win-at-all-costs approach, not showing temper after a mistake, and not competing solely for prizes

    Sportsmanship... is your actions..your view..your honor

    Not just in public .. but alone as well... alot of people have good sportsmanship while they are seen by others but once they are out of site it another story.
     
  19. Mickey

    Mickey New Member Supporting Member

    Messages:
    14,592
    State:
    Illinois
    Thanks Walter for an excellent statement. Reps to you.
     
  20. wolfman

    wolfman Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    9,081
    State:
    Triadelphia, WV
    Name:
    Walter Flack
    Mark J has commented exactly what Im getting at. Its the level of enjoyment you get from the chase. Fair chase can be measured at many different levels from one person to the next as long as they're practicing good angling ethics.