Epoxy over plywood coverage??

Discussion in 'Boat Modification Journal' started by DANZIG, Jul 21, 2009.

  1. DANZIG

    DANZIG New Member

    Messages:
    6,672
    State:
    West Virginia
    'Bout time to order epoxy for the transom,,, How much will go how far?
    Square foot.
     
  2. Mark J

    Mark J New Member

    Messages:
    9,407
    State:
    Four Oaks, NC
    A gallon should be a plenty but tell me exactly what you are doing so i have a better idea.
     

  3. thudpucker

    thudpucker New Member

    Messages:
    458
    State:
    Culman AL
    Why Epoxy? Why not plain ol' Porch n' Deck paint?
    What about Primer and a matching paint?
     
  4. Mark J

    Mark J New Member

    Messages:
    9,407
    State:
    Four Oaks, NC
    Primer and paint comes after the epoxy.
     
  5. DANZIG

    DANZIG New Member

    Messages:
    6,672
    State:
    West Virginia
    Well, I have two roughly 74 X 28 x3/4 pieces (minus the cut out for the outboard well, have not measured it yet, maybe 28 X 19)

    Gonna need to "glue" 'em and coat 'em, plus filling the holes for "redrill". 4 for the engine mount, 2 for the motor well drains, and 14 smaller other "tru- hulls"(six for the brace and 8 for port and starboard edges) and numerous other that will not be thru hull. (attaching the motor well and the "board to "ledger" connection at the bottom of the transom boards.

    Damn, when I think about it all at once,,, that is a freaking lot of holes!
     
  6. DANZIG

    DANZIG New Member

    Messages:
    6,672
    State:
    West Virginia
    "Why Epoxy? Why not plain ol' Porch n' Deck paint?"

    In this boat, getting back in to replace the transom(again) would be a huge pain. Not so bad now as I have stripped her to the hull anyway.

    The plan is to keep this one for many a moon and I hope to do this only once. :big_smile:
     
    Last edited: Jul 21, 2009
  7. Mark J

    Mark J New Member

    Messages:
    9,407
    State:
    Four Oaks, NC
    I would say a gallon would do it.
    If you've never used epoxy before you will probally use more then it should take.
    We all went through that.
    My gallon might be a gallon and a half to you.

    As far as epoxy here is what I would do.
    Looking at the price of a gallon is in the neighborhood of 80 bucks and you have shipping.
    The brand Marine epoxy is about the cheapest thing going and it's damn good epoxy. No blush and great for laying glass in my opinion. User friendly.
    3 gallons for 155.00 plus shipping.
    There is alot of savings in buying 3 gallons. Basicly you get a free gallon.
    Use what you need and sell what is left on here to someone else with a project to recoup your money. In the end you save and that person will save.
    I might even buy a gallon off you myself if the price is right.

    You'll need filler. Wood flour.
    To glue the two pieces together you'll need the wood flour to thicken the epoxy to a ketchup like consistency. You'll need wood flour to fill your holes for redrilling.
    I would also cover both sides of your finished transom with cloth if nothing but 6oz. 2 layers each side and she'll be bullet proof. It will also keep the wood from checking.
    I say 2 layers of 6 oz because 6 oz is a dream to work with. Easy to wet out especially if you've never laid much glass with epoxy.

    Consummables you'll need.
    Latex or similar type gloves
    Tongue depressors for mixing. The large ones found in the Walmart craft section.

    Mixing containers. I like plastic bowls with the round bottom, not the flat bottom. Just cheapo ones. I bought mine at the dollar store for a couple of bucks for a stack of 5. Since the epoxy doesn't bond with plastic you can flex the bowl after it cures and peel it out to reuse the bowl.

    I also use the plastic quart cups from Lowes with the measurements on the side found in the paint department. I usually cut mine down with a razor knife to make them shallower. Same deal. You can reuse them.
    Rollers. I use the foam rollers. 4" and 6". The rollers that have the small hole in them. About a 1/4" hole. The rollers you find at Lowes are not epoxy compatible but you have a small project. It shouldn't be an issue.
    If you were laying glass on a hull it would become an issue when the roller started flaking off.

    Pumps. When you order epoxy, order the pumps too. 2 pumps are about 10 bucks. It cuts out measuring your epoxy. 2 pumps of resin, 1 pump of hardener. These pumps will last a long time. Alot longer then your project.
    White vinegar. If you make a boo boo with some epoxy, white vinegar will cut it if you get to it before it cures.

    I wouldnt worry about paint trays. Pour some epoxy on your work and spread it around with the roller. Once your roller saturates you can spread epoxy effectively with a roller.

    Some 1" and 3" plastic spackling knives. You can use these several times before they need to be trashed and you can custom shape them if the need arises. I use a 1" to shovel my fillers into the epoxy mixing bowl.

    Some cheap 1" chip brushes. Don't dump alot of money into brushes. These are one time use. You aren't going to clean epoxy out of brushes or rollers.

    Plastic. Some visqueen is fine. Keeps epoxy off everything else and if you glass you can glass one side, flip it over onto the plastic and glass the other side. Get it all at one time.Plastic doesn't bond to epoxy.
    You actually do this if you are peel plying. The part against the plastic will be smooth when it cures.

    That is pretty much it.
    Once you get ready and set on go I'll make a detailed step by step post.
    In the mean time there is several how to articles and videos over on Bateau.com that shows mixing and laminating.

    Your finish. I don't know what you want the exposed part of the transom to look like. If you glass and want to fill the weave you have a couple of options.
    Quickfair is a systems 3 product. Sort of expensive. I wouldn't mess with it on this project. On a boat hull I would say spend the money.

    Multiple coats of epoxy. Just uses more epoxy.
    The option I would use is micro balloons. Microscopic spheres mixed into the epoxy. It's like the bondo of boatbuilding. Couple of coats with a putty knife and and orbital sander and it will be ready to prime and paint.

    Primer. All primers don't work well with epoxy as far as bonding.
    One I can attest to is brightsides Primecoat. 2 part and has to be thinned with Brightsides 333N. A quart would be a plenty. Somewhere around 30 bucks. The thinner is about 24 a quart. I looked into making my own by searching for the MSDS on it. There is about 6 ingredients and just isnt worth trying to find them all or the acid that goes in it.
    I assume the acid etches the epoxy.

    At any rate you'll have to paint over the epoxy as UV will eventually break down epoxy.

    I can probally help you out with wood flour. I usually buy 5 pounds at the time. I need to rotate some stock. If it just sits and sits it's going to draw moisture.
     
  8. DANZIG

    DANZIG New Member

    Messages:
    6,672
    State:
    West Virginia
    "The brand Marine epoxy is about the cheapest thing going and it's damn good epoxy."

    Yep, that is what I have been looking at. It has decent reviews and a decent price.

    "and videos over on Bateau.com "

    Have those, and a couple others, "favorited" already.


    I am thinking that I can skip a "finish", the finished product should never see the sun unless I have to rip her apart again.
     
  9. Mark J

    Mark J New Member

    Messages:
    9,407
    State:
    Four Oaks, NC
    In that case you probally got a 3 day job in getting the transom ready to install
    Best way to get the most out your day with epoxy.
    Work with your epoxy first thing in the morning early.
    By late afternoon you'll be able to work with some more epoxy.
    So that is twice in a day you can have hands on.

    Spend the first day precoating everything twice.
    Second day glueing and glassing.
    Third day drilling and filling holes.
    And on the 4th day drink beer.
     
  10. Mark J

    Mark J New Member

    Messages:
    9,407
    State:
    Four Oaks, NC
    I'm going to build me a boat this time. Well unless somebody offers me good money for it.
    But seriously my next build is solely intended for my use.
    So many plans to choose from but I have my heart set on a 22x8-1/2 center console bay boat.
    I'm still screwing around with a budget for the build. My goal was to come in at 16,000 turn keyfish ready. It will be a hard nimber to stick to with a T-Top and electronics. I would like to spring for an aluminum trailer too.

    It will be a valued around 40k.
     
  11. Catpaw

    Catpaw Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    8,941
    State:
    Central Cail
    Name:
    James
    Mark when the time is right and you start your build i hope you post pic's as the build come's along , I know it will be long project but it would be cool to see the build as it take's place.
     
  12. Mark J

    Mark J New Member

    Messages:
    9,407
    State:
    Four Oaks, NC
    It's going to be A pretty big hull as most are. The sad thing about pictures is that you lose alot. A picture doesn't do them justice.
    Same with a fish.

    Modern space age materials. That big of a boat maxes at 120 HP. She'll handle alot more engine then that though if you do the calculations.
    120 HP will be plenty. Alot lighter then an all glass boat.
     
  13. DANZIG

    DANZIG New Member

    Messages:
    6,672
    State:
    West Virginia
    "And on the 4th day drink beer.'

    Sound advice!! :smile2:
     
  14. Mark J

    Mark J New Member

    Messages:
    9,407
    State:
    Four Oaks, NC
    Well I just threw that in there because it sounded right.
    If i have sandpaper in my left hand I have a beer in the right hand.
    If I've got the jugs of epoxy out, I got an open beer right beside them.

    It's a motivational thing.
     
  15. DANZIG

    DANZIG New Member

    Messages:
    6,672
    State:
    West Virginia
    Good to know that we can agree on something! :wink::smile2:
     
  16. Mark J

    Mark J New Member

    Messages:
    9,407
    State:
    Four Oaks, NC
    I very very rarely drink at home.
    At the shop is a different story. I've got to be doing more then sitting in a recliner while drinking beer.

    Even the new mower came with a beer holder.

    As far as a boat. Don't worry, those water rings that a sweating beer leaves behind sand out pretty easy.:smile2:
    Only one thing sands easier. The bugs in the epoxy.
     
  17. DANZIG

    DANZIG New Member

    Messages:
    6,672
    State:
    West Virginia
    Yep, I have gotten to be that way over the years.
    Even drinking parties involve tools and projects.
    The "work" ran off a lot of freeloaders that used to hang around.:wink:

    My crowd's phone conversations often go like this,,, "Hey, I need help with....." and the only acceptable answer, short of a death in the family, is,,, " Will work for beer, what time you need me there?
     
  18. Laker2

    Laker2 New Member

    Messages:
    29
    State:
    Illinois
    Boy I wish you guys lived closer- You are both my kind of people:smile2::smile2::smile2::smile2::smile2:
     
  19. Mark J

    Mark J New Member

    Messages:
    9,407
    State:
    Four Oaks, NC
    All you need is a U Haul
    You wouldn't be the first nor last to flee south.:wink: