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Are crossbows more like bows or more like a rifle?

6491 Views 74 Replies 13 Participants Last post by  Mrjc
Ok, to me xbows are more like bows. Their primary force to propel their projectile is a string, not gunpowder. The primary force behind a bullet is gunpowder. You do have to pull that string back to cock it, although you dont have to hold it. But compound bows have up to a 65% letoff, if its all about making it as hard as possible dont make allowances for any weapon. The letoff is clearly a mechanical advantage over primitive bows. The range of a xbow is similar to that of a compound bow, and nowhere near the range of a rifle, pistol, or muzzleloader. Ok a xbow uses a trigger to release the arrow, but dont many bowhunters pull a trigger also, I know I do.

I guess my main objection with a vertical bow only season for the majority of the season is I hear all this talk about how primitive it is. ITs not. Now if you want to say primitive bows only, recurve, longbow or whatever, that I can understand. Take away all mechanical advantages of bows and I would agree on the primitive aspect of bowhunting as well. Why do people think that a xbow makes people think they can shoot better and farther. Couldnt be the persons fault could it?

If we blame the weapon were all in trouble. Pack up your bows, rifles, pistols and frog spears cause its the weapons fault. Not the idiot holding it. Xbows dont make people stupid or slobs, they were already that way. I know ill never see eye to eye with bowhunters on this one.
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OK brother let me break this down for you:

Hunting Bow

1. 1. A device for launching an arrow, which derives its propulsive energy solely from the bending and recovery of two limbs.

2. The bow must be hand drawn by a single and direct, uninterrupted pulling action of the shooter. The bowstring must be moved from brace height to the full draw position by the muscle power of the shooter’s body. The energy used to propel the arrow shall not be derived from any other source such as hydraulic, pneumatic, mechanical or similar devices. These limitations shall not exclude the mechanical leverage advantage provided by eccentric wheels or cams so long as the available energy stored in the bent limbs of the bow is the sole result of a single, continuous, and direct pulling effort by the shooter.

3. The bow must be hand-held. One hand shall hold the bow and the other hand draw the bowstring. The bowstring must be moved and/or held at all points in the draw cycle entirely by the muscle power of the shooter until release. The bowstring must be released as a direct and conscious action of the shooter’s either relaxing the tension of the fingers or triggering the release action of a hand-held release aid.

4. The bow shall be no shorter than 30 inches.

[U]B. Exceptions: Physically handicapped bow hunters shall be excepted from the requirements of holding or shooting the bow with their hands.[/U]

1. The following shall not be considered a hunting bow:

a. A crossbow.

b. Any device with a gun-type stock or incorporating any device or mechanism that holds the bowstring at partial or full draw without the shooter’s muscle power.

c. Electronic or battery-powered devices shall not be attached to a hunting bow.

d. No portion of the bow’s riser (handle) or any track, trough, channel or other device that attachés directly to the bow’s riser shall contact, support, and/or guide the arrow from a point rearward of the bow’s brace height.

1. Definition of let-off: That characteristic of a bow that results in a reduction of the force necessary to increase the draw length after the highest level of draw force has been reached. This is characteristic generally associated with, but not restricted to, compound bows.

2. The maximum let-off on a compound bow shall be measured at a point in the draw cycle after the peak draw weight has been attained. It shall be measured near the end of the draw cycle where the minimum holding force is reached. This point in the draw cycle on a compound bow is known as "the bottom of the valley."

3. Determination of the percent of let-off: The values of the peak draw force and the let-off force shall be used to calculate the percent of let-off. The peak force is the maximum force obtained during the draw cycle. The let-off force is the lowest force reached following the peak force during a single uninterrupted draw cycle. In all cases, both the highest and lowest force shall be read from a scale during a single and continual pull condition, without relaxation. This technique eliminates the introduction of hysteresis, which can distort the reading.

% Let-off = 100 X [(Peak Draw Force) - (Minimum Holding Force)] / (Peak Draw Force)

4. Effective January 1, 2004, animals taken with bows have nominal percent of let-off greater than 65 percent shall be listed with an asterisk (*) in the Records. It is recognized that variations in draw length and/or draw weight can affect the percent of let-off on compound bows. For these reasons minor variations in let-off are acceptable.

That is from POPE AND YOUNG I don't think you can argue with them.
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PBS National Anti-Crossbow Committee
The PBS National Anti-Crossbow Committee was established in 1986 in response to increasing threats to the integrity of the archery-only hunting seasons by those manufacturers and other hunters wanting to use crossbows during the archery-only hunting season. Since then, this Committee has led a national effort to educate bowhunters, legislators, state fish and game agencies, and other hunters to the threats presented by those who want to use crossbows in archery-only hunting seasons.

Bowhunting was meant to be, and is, a difficult and demanding sport. It requires a high level of dedication from its participants if they want to be successful on a regular basis. Today's modern compound bows, coupled with sight pins and mechanical releases, have done much to make it easier for beginning and also experienced archers to reach and maintain levels of proficiency necessary for hunting. Unfortunately, there are still those sportsmen who are not willing to put forth the time and effort to learn to shoot this equipment proficiently but who still want to be permitted to hunt during the archery-only hunting seasons. The crossbow is the perfect answer for today's opportunistic hunter who lacks the dedication and commitment required to be a bowhunter. He's not willing to play by the rules so he attempts to remake them to permit himself to use a more efficient weapons that is much easier to use.

Where does the interest for crossbow seasons originate? For the most part it is the manufacturers of crossbows who are trying to stimulate interest and get crossbow seasons established. For them, crossbows represent an opportunity to sell a lot of equipment to those sportsmen who have not taken up bowhunting. Crossbows will only be popular if they can be used during archery-only hunting seasons. Few hunters will want to use a crossbow if their use is restricted to muzzleloading and gun seasons. Crossbow manufacturers are providing free hunts and equipment to many outdoor writers who in return write favorable articles trying to stimulate interest in establishing crossbow seasons. It is the manufacturers who stand to profit, not interested hunters, who are pushing hardest to establish crossbow seasons.

What can be expected if crossbows are legal for use during archery-only hunting seasons? The answer to this question can be found in the state of Ohio where crossbows were made legal for use during the entire archery-only hunting season in the early 1980's. The harvest trend is outlined below (statistics from Ohio DNR publication #166):

Yearly Harvest by Weapon Type

Weapon 1982 1985 1988 1991 1993
Hand-Held Bow 3782 3339 5322 7708 10,155
Crossbow 446 1689 4716 9401 13,055
The Ohio statistics clearly show that bowhunters have become a minority in their own hunting season. The gap worsens with each hunting season.

A comprehensive study comparing the shooting efficiency of crossbows versus hand-held bows was conducted by a professional consulting firm. Hand-held bow shooters were able to keep their shots in a kill zone out to 26 yards while crossbow shooters were able to shoot equivalent groups out to 60 yards. Crossbow shooters with no prior shooting experience with any weapon were able to outperform top competitive hand-held bow shooters who were using modern compound bows equipped with sight pins and release aids. Detailed copies of the Marlow Study may be obtained through the PBS home office for a nominal fee to cover copying and shipping costs.
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NO he doesnt so check the law the laws says he doesnt have the right to hunt with a cross bow so you need to do more research.
Your question was is a crossbow more like bows or rifles I think that has been answered and yet some still dont want to accept it.
You guys take the cake come to Missouri with your cross bow and I will be the first to call the DNR and tell them that your hunting with it. You can explain to them how you have the right to hunt with it as they take it and your truck or car and all your hunting gear. Your so right about the crossbow being more like the bow I hold mine up to my shoulder with a stick that keeps the bow string held back for me until I pull the trigger. I dont have to spend months honing my skills to hunt I can just lock and load and go again great points guys your really making your case.......
Chatfield, MN - A meeting of the state and provincial-level bow hunting organizations was held at the Pope and Young Club's headquarters in Chatfield, Minnesota on August 6Th and 7Th to further address important bow hunting issues that were identified at the National Bow hunting Summit held in Springfield, Missouri this spring.

Attended by 41 representatives of 33 organizations (in 29 states and Canadian provinces), the Minnesota conferees completed a crossbow position statement, were taught by experienced bow hunting activists how to strengthen their political skills and how to build a more effective bow hunting organization. They addressed the increased anti-bow hunting threat, began work on a program to assist physically challenged archers to shoot modified conventional bows and developed plans to prepare a position paper on high fenced hunting. Dr. Dave Samuel served as moderator for the conference.

As the result of the National Bow hunting Summit meetings, its was abundantly clear that the organized bow hunting community is strongly opposed to the growing trend by game agencies of permitting crossbows to be used in bow seasons. A position statement on the crossbow issue was developed and was signed on to by 72 bow hunting organizations and bow hunting related businesses. The position taken is that "crossbows are not bows and therefore should not be permitted in bow seasons or in archery-only hunting areas."

You guys are right and all these bow hunters are wrong 41 rep. from 33 org. has to be wrong because you are to lazy to take a bow out and learn to shot and kill with it. Don't use the excuse of some people don't have time there is ample time during the summer months to become proficient with a bow.
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Im not going to come to Ky and hunt before season opens because I follow the law Im not the one saying I have the right not to and do what I want to do. Back up what your saying with fact instead of just because you think it should be that way.
I didn't turn it into an all out arena I merely posted facts as you guys keep asking for and the facts state everything that we have been saying in black and white. It doesn't matter what we refute you with you still are going to come back and take everything personal because you obviously are failing to read the information that has been put in front of you. Now to com pair this to what happened in NO that is just wrong no other way to look at that. With people like that for cross bows I'm against it. Disputing Pope and Young please what do they have to gain........Its the same manufactures that manufacture compound bows that make the cross bows so your point is....?
. Most of the skill, in my opinion, comes from scouting and getting into the location that a deer will most likely give you a shot. Thats 99% of the work. If you lack that skill, it doesn't matter how polished you become honing your skills for months before season, because you'll never see a deer to use your shooting ability.

Now that is something we can agree on brother the Skill comes in from putting yourself in the right place at the right time I have never stated otherwise it is exactly the point I was making.......Regardless what you are hunting or shooting it doesnt matter if you cant scout and know what sign you are looking for.....Thus bow hunters have to be better at what they do to be able to killl a deer.....Crossbow hunters would have to be the same better at hunting then a rifle hunter that can sit a field and shoot 100-300 yrds. The hunting to me comes in way before the season and after the season it doesnt start when you pick up your weapon of choice and kill the animal it starts right after the season and ends right before the season the killing is the easy part.
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Check out this link if you dont think the cross bow is more like the rifle even the people that are selling them call them Rifle crossbows....... Even the NRA is advertising on this site. This is not propaganda from BOW HUNTERS only its from your own people.

Look at it again its a straight crossbow. You guys wanted proof and facts We keep giving them to you and you come back with some off the wall giberish to try and combat what your fellow crossgun hunters are doing. Man you guys need to get on the same page if nothing else.
I didnt realize that Bass Pro or Cabela's were the resident experts.......
The question was answered with your own type of weapon I didn't make up the web site I mearly posted it and once again you are trying to make an excuse for what is already there your argument on this one for that is weak at best. Oh yea hears anouther....

You cant deny the obvious I didn't realize there was a difference between a real crossbow and fly by night crossbow. You can try but it still doesn't change the fact the some of the manufactures call the thing a rifle crossbow.

As bass pro being the resident expert I guess I should go and buy my compound bow from them as well.......NOT
Its kinda like working at a Hardware store your home town hardware store will give you advise and a first hand knowledge of what you are buying and how to use it. But go to the big chains and you find they don't really know as the workers are put there to sell what they have. Now Bass pro is mearly a tourist trap I'm not saying they don't have good merchandise but I for one do not hold bass pro as an expert on anything as the workers at bass pro are mearly there to sell. I would rather go to any bow shop that specializes in bow and then buy a bow and consider them a resident expert. How many of the high range bows do you find at bass pro not many for example Bass pro doesn't sell any Mathews Bows ever wonder why Ill leave that for you to figure out since they are the experts.
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Go to the Bass Pro web site and type in Rifle crossbow or crossbow rifle and see for yourself what comes up since they are the resident experts. Im still waiting for your proof or our we left to the old just believe me because I say so. Matter of fact go to Cabela's and do it since they also are the experts you might be suprized what you find.........
To-shay Verotik very well done. Nice come back on that one.

Now as to the classification I wouldnt classify a crossbow with a rifle a shotgun or a muzzleloader. I would have to classifiy it on its own merit. It shoots like a rifle (shotgun or Muzzleloader) in that it is shoulder fired. It shoots like a bow in that it has a bow string that launches the arrow. The big differance is that the string is cocked and the hunter doesnt have to hold the string back to fire. It is also more steady as it is a shoulder fired weapon. So with that said it stands alone as a cross bred of the two weapons. Therefore it shouldnt be classified as either and also should be classified as both. So is the crossbow more like a riffle the answere is YES is it more like a Bow the answere is still YES. Thus is the problem what came first the chicken or the egg?
LOL your ok in my book even though you are confussed about the crossbow......LOL Im not tell what I think could be chicken could be egg. I really dont know.
Man I miss the heck out of the High intensity area Its good to be able to debate a subject again though it passes the time makes a man think and also enlightens some area's that where before not thought to much of. Ive had a wonderful time debating this with you and the rest. I hope you can come back with pics of a big old bruiser to show off. The invitation remains open if you want to hunt missouri you have a place to stay allways. In reality I dont think the crossbow will be stopped and we will see it in play most everywhere. I had someone asked me today if I could get them signed off by a therapist to use a crossbow and there was nothing wrong with them at all its really easy to get the paperworked signed if thats the route you want to take.

Happy Hunting
I couldnt have said it better brother. By the way quadman I dont know any and I know alot of bowhunters that dont rifle, shotgun, and or Muzzleloader hunt. I happen to be one of the proud that do it all and wouldnt change it for anything. I will also fight to keep them out of Missouri I don't think it would help the sport at all. One thing that I have found about Bow Hunters is the willing ness to introduce the sport to all and any that go out and get themselfs a bow. I havent seen that in the traditional rifle hunter what I have seen with turkey hunters and Im using this in general is a willness not to introduce new people into there sport. Not the help the new guy out by calling in a bird. That may just be from around here as I am new to turkey hunting and have only done it for 3 yrs. Maybe BowHunter are opinionated if so then so be it I for one would rather it stay that way because if you dont love the Bow Hunt with all your heart then you problely shouldnt be out there. No you wouldnt be out there in the cold and snow and rain waiting for hours up in a tree with your toes frozen only to see squirles day after day after day after day and yet get up at 0400 the next day for 3 months straight hoping for a chance one chance at shoting even a doe.
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Verotic if the High Intensity area opens back up you should go ahead and join the Over opinionated crowd in there you would fit in just fine.
I just spoke with a friend of mine the friend that got me bow hunting in the first place and discussed the cross bow issue with him. He asked me what are you afraid of with the guys with crossbow so I went down the list. His answere to me was dont worry to much about those guys because at first it will be new and alot of these jokers will run out to the woods with there cross bows but where the tire meets the road is most of them wont have the passion deep inside that the sport of bow hunting demands and will fall by the wayside going back to hunting during the 10 day gun season. That is not directed at anyone as he has not been or will be in this discussion. After talking with him I did realize that it will fade away like a fad and the compound hunter my be the minority in the woods for a while but the true die hard hunters will return to there roots like the prodical son and the few others will love the sport as much as we love Bow Hunting.
He also asked me why did I think that there is so many gun hunters. His answere was its such a short season and its an excuse for some to camp and get drunk its not about the hunt for most so many never take to the Bow woods or the Muzzleloader woods. I think is right as I have respected him for many years and he has taught me just about everything I know about hunting.
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