Ambassadeur Royal Express Problem

Discussion in 'Reel Repair and Upgrades' started by bassstrat, Mar 13, 2009.

  1. bassstrat

    bassstrat New Member

    Messages:
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    State:
    s.c.
    I have a Royal Express that won`t engage after the cast,unless I push in on the handle as I start reeling.If I don`t the handle will just spin for days!Once engaged everything works great. Any suggestions on what to try?
     
  2. gilmafam

    gilmafam Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    5,466
    State:
    California
    Had probems with my C3's or like item.... can't remember.... mostly the problem was stink bait in the push-button mechanism.... got to clean the reel out..... sometimes it is the tension of the "take apart" screws that seem to miss allign things.

    Good luck.... Bayrunner Ray
     

  3. Ken D

    Ken D New Member

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    160
    State:
    B.C. (CAD)
    Good day, Bsssss: Could you advise the number you see on the underside of the reel, on the foot? Just the first *4*numbers, and could you say the size of the reel? RE I, II, or III?

    We will then get you to the schematic, and use the part nos, to help you in your quest for fire. Best, KD
     
  4. bassstrat

    bassstrat New Member

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    State:
    s.c.
    The numbers on the bottom(reel seat) are: 0200 02,and I guess this would be a Royal Express I?,it`s the narrow 4600 size.Thanks for your help Ken! Bassstrat
     
  5. Ken D

    Ken D New Member

    Messages:
    160
    State:
    B.C. (CAD)
    Hio, Mr. Bass-ster.....here is the link to the schematic:
    I'm hoping you are comfy with entering the reel. If not, perhaps you can take it to a buddy who's OK with this.

    http://www.abugarcia.com/product_schematic.php?id=226.228.1629#

    Scroll down a short way, till you see the 02-00 version. It's the first RE (royal express) on the list.

    There are several reasons for your condition, and sometimes a combination of the reasons.

    The first place to look would be crud under 20560 arm. Next would be a jam-up of 20664 pinion jack, on the two pins it sits on. These pins are also the screw-down places for the brake plate to the side plate.

    The most common culprit is the postion holder 20686....the stainless steel " fingers" lose their tension, and get weak.

    Next most common with this vintage of reels, would be a broken return spring 20670, which now changes up to a 22804.

    Not so common would be a distorted side plate 21174.

    Hopefully you will spot one of these things as "the reason".

    CAUTIONARY NOTE.....when re-assembling, place the reel in casting mode manually, by either moving the clutch arm 20560 by hand, or inserting a small screwdriver in the crescent slot under the brake plate, where the PIN on the cast thumb bar fits into. You;ll see the slot.... it's right there.
    The thumb bar pin needs to enter the crescent un-impeded, to work correctly. You may as well check the pin to make sure it's not bent, or crooked, while you are there.

    ALSO: ensure that the position holder is on top of the pinion ramp, not underneath.

    Good fixin.........KD
     
  6. bassstrat

    bassstrat New Member

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    State:
    s.c.
    Ken all these parts appear to be OK and working properly.On the position holder(20686)which way could I try to maybe bend these "fingers"to see if this does any good?They are now putting pressure on(bent down)on the pinion jack(20664).Is this correct,or should I try bending them up away from it?I also cleaned everything so there is no gunk there.Another question that has popped up is, in what position does parts 5131 and 3904 (washers)go? I put them all on top of the shaft,just before the star drag wheel,but it seems there is a gap/space there that should`nt be there,unless I tighten down the drag incredibly tight. This seems to be a very simple reel compared to some of the other versions,but it sure has me stumped??? Thanks for your help! BASSSTRAT
     
  7. Ken D

    Ken D New Member

    Messages:
    160
    State:
    B.C. (CAD)
    Hio, B......The position holder is a 3.00 part, and it's really hard to save it, by re-bending the fingers. About 1 in 5 will work. Without gages, it's hard to get the fingers even, to exert the same pressure on both sides.

    Anyway....one other place to look at would be the tiny right angle bend of very end of the clutch arm 20560. the bend catches the square teeth of the driveshaft 20957 and retracts the arm, as the driveshaft goes ahead.

    You can re-bend this angle to make better contact with the driveshaft....carefully grasp the main part of the clutch arm with pliers, and with another pair, re-bend the end. You only want to bend the end, not the entire arm. If the end has worn too much, and rounded over or worn down, past a possible fix, a new clutch arm is about 4.00.

    Ensure that washer 5189 is still where it's supposed to be, on the brake plate post.
    If this part is lost, or not in place, there is excess play of the driveshaft on the brake plate, causing many casting misfires.

    If memory serves, your version also does not have a real return spring.... it's more of a flat clip style. (20970) This thing gets weak as well, and you can re-bend it a lot wider, carefully, to provide more tension, for a little while.
    The coil spring replacement is about 65 cents.

    Later Abus went to a position holder with a built-in spring, forever taking care of broken-weak ones.

    Spacer 20954 may have a round end, and a square end. Ensure the square end is down.

    The 2 belleville washers (5131) can be placed (), or )(....not ((, or )).
    3904 washer goes on top of the bellevilles, so the star can hit it first.

    When it comes time to re-assemble, the three thumb screws need only be tightened about 1/2 turn past finger tight. If the thumb screws are overtightened, it sets up a stress fight between the brake plate and the frame, which can cause pinion ramp to stick, preventing position holder from retraction.

    Hopefully, you will be fishing soon.

    Without seeing the reel, I'm out of suggestions. If I missed somthing as you get the reel running, let us know, to add the condition to the knowledge base, for the next fellow.

    Stay well, KD.
     
  8. bassstrat

    bassstrat New Member

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    State:
    s.c.
    Ken,thanks so much for the help! After re-aligning the washers and spacers,and doing your other tips the reel seems pretty close to normal! There is a slight hesitation before engagement,but 90% better than it was! Thanks again!!! Bassstrat