Ambassadeur 6000 spool engagement

Discussion in 'Reel Repair and Upgrades' started by cmyers, Oct 20, 2008.

  1. cmyers

    cmyers New Member

    Messages:
    18
    State:
    WV
    I just received a factory reconditioned Ambassadeur 6000 (reel foot #09-01) and it has a quirky problem. I hope that someone can suggest a fix!

    Most of the time I can press the free spool button then crank the handle, and the pinion gear engages the spool (clutch washer actually I suppose) just fine and begins to retrieve. Occasionally, however (maybe 1 in 6-8 times) it feels like the pinion gear doesn't fully engage the spool properly and it cranks a little bit stiffly...but at that time if I hold the spool while I continue to crank, something (I assume the pinion gear) seems to "click" in place and then it retrieves as normal.

    Any thoughts as to what might be causing this? It is after all a factory reconditioned reel so if all else fails I have 90 days to return it, but if I can fix it for a reasonable amount to avoid shipping charges etc that would be wonderful.

    Thanks!
    cm
     
  2. bigbigjoe76

    bigbigjoe76 New Member

    Messages:
    67
    State:
    Gilbert, South Carolina
    sounds like a piece of trash or maybe a burr on something. i would say pull the reel apart and clean and inspect it. i know you say it is factory reconditioned but ANYBODY can accidently get trash in a reel when rebuilding. iv'e bought reels that were suppose to have been reconditioned and you should have seen the junk i pulled out of them.
     

  3. cmyers

    cmyers New Member

    Messages:
    18
    State:
    WV
    Thanks for the reply BigBigJoe. I've had it apart and there's no obvious trash in it. No burrs that I can see but that's not saying that there aren't any. It acts as if the pinion gear doesn't slip up over that brass bushing that's fastened to the axle...but if I hold the spool and crank the handle it then slips over it and operates as normal. I don't know if the pinion is getting skewed sideways or if maybe the axle is bent.

    Thanks again.
    cm
     
  4. Ken D

    Ken D New Member

    Messages:
    160
    State:
    B.C. (CAD)
    Hio.....if the inside of the pinion is true, and the axle is not bent, then the next suspect is the position holder. The finger pressure goes incorrect, and causes glitches.

    2 rarities, but still potentials: the pinion itself....the 'ramps' machined into it, sometimes wear prematurely, and unevenly, so they don't quite mesh with the clutch washer.

    And: the pinion yoke and holder. Extremely rarely, this part will catch and ride unevenly on the 2 brass posts on the brake plate.


    The position holder is a 3.00 part. The pinion is a 9.00 part, the pinion yoke may need a fast check. In the 15+ years I've been around these reels, I've never seen a worn yoke, but a few sticky ones.

    I'm going with the position holder as the culprit. Nothing is certain, not even a coronary bypass, there are always odds against. I'm happy with 98% in favour of the position holder.




    It's really hard to adjust the 2 'prongers' evenly to try and save it, so for 3.00, fresh is good.
     
  5. cmyers

    cmyers New Member

    Messages:
    18
    State:
    WV
    Thanks Ken for the reply, and you may be on to something. However I've noticed something else. Comparing it to the schematic, I see that this reel apparently is missing the sleeve (#22001) and the friction washer (#5115) AND although the spring washers (#5131) are present, they were installed where the friction washer (#5115) should have been!

    Perhaps this is part of the problem. If I called Abu and asked for those parts, would they likely ship them to me? Or have I voided warranties or such by opening this reel up? If I have to order those parts, I may as well go ahead and order a new position holder along with them.

    -cm
     
  6. cmyers

    cmyers New Member

    Messages:
    18
    State:
    WV
    Nevermind...the parts are there. Sleeve was tucked up inside the anti-reverse bearing, and the other parts were indeed in their respective places. I'll consider the position holder.

    -cm
     
  7. cmyers

    cmyers New Member

    Messages:
    18
    State:
    WV
    Just some more troubleshooting...I put the reel together without the spool, so it had a bare axle going from one side plate to the next. When I engage the reel, the pinion gear slips nicely over the brass bushing that's on the axle. Never does it miss.

    It's when I add the spool that the problems arise, so it must be something keeping the pinion gear from engaging correctly on the spool right away. Is that what the position holder is supposed to do?

    Thanks!
    cm
     
  8. Ken D

    Ken D New Member

    Messages:
    160
    State:
    B.C. (CAD)
    Hio, Chas..... when cast mode is engaged, the pinion ramp jacks up the pinion,
    so the spool can free-wheel, causing energy to be stored in the holder's fingers.

    (You do have the holder on top of the ramp, yes? Several sports put the position holder _underneath_ 20664, after a peek inside..)

    When reel is sent to crank, the position holder's stored finger energy sends the pinion back down for reeling. If the tension on the fingers is off, then the pinion struggles to drop.

    While the reel is in repair mode, may as well check the placement of the 22001 sleeve....the squared end needs to be down on top of the 20960 last drag metal washer. The 'roundy' end needs to up towards the 5131's and the star.

    Later 22001's have both ends squared, to prevent a bad install.
     
  9. cmyers

    cmyers New Member

    Messages:
    18
    State:
    WV
    Thanks for the tip on the sleeve. Checked it and it appears to be the same on both ends, so I must have one of the latter ones.

    -cm
     
  10. s_man

    s_man New Member

    Messages:
    3,012
    State:
    south east ohio
    When you reassemble all the drag washers and spacers on that gear and set it, twist it back and forth to make sure it is seated. I have found that you can place it in and the reel will work just as you describe. Then when I take it back apart it has sliped back like a 1/16, because of trying to get it back together. And make sure the drag is tightened down to at least the minimum. If you just screw the star on and have no drag at all you can get the same effect. Plus a spool that slides side to side.
     
  11. flathunter

    flathunter New Member

    Messages:
    5,723
    State:
    Ohio
    I have had an bau reel that has done that same thing for many years, i never fixed it and it's still going strong!