6500C3 upgrade to Instant Anti-Reverse?

Discussion in 'Reel Repair and Upgrades' started by cmyers, Oct 13, 2008.

  1. cmyers

    cmyers New Member

    Messages:
    18
    State:
    WV
    I posted this in another forum before I found this one and thought it would be more appropriate....so here goes again:

    I bought what appears to be an older 6500C3 on eBay and it has the dog style anti-reverse rather than the IAR bearing. Can I slip on the IAR bearing in place of the existing roller bearing to make it IAR? If so, does anyone have the part number for the IAR bearing for the 6500C3?

    The number on the foot is: 990503 and I can't find its schematics on Abu Garcia's website as far as I can tell.

    Thanks!
     
  2. Ken D

    Ken D New Member

    Messages:
    160
    State:
    B.C. (CAD)
    Hio.....that particular schematic is out there.... I will find it and post it in this thread. Later..................KD See below attachment.
     

  3. Ken D

    Ken D New Member

    Messages:
    160
    State:
    B.C. (CAD)
    ***found it*** here you are.

    Now then.... if this is _indeed_ your reel, with the ball bearing in the crank boss, not the nylon solid bushing, you are hooped. The OD of the crank boss is fatter in IAR reels, than the ones with either the bb, or the bushing.

    Even if you bored out the boss to take the IAR bearing, you would shear off the entire boss in a trip or or two, because of the way the boss is fastened in the older reels.

    ALSO: you need to ensure that the spacers in this reel are orientated correctly and placed right. Your reel will not function correctly without these spacers, or spacers placed wrongly. Pn 22083.
    Hope this helps. best, KD
     

    Attached Files:

  4. Whistler

    Whistler Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,084
    State:
    TN
    If someone would do a complete write up with pics, I'll put it in the library for you. Just shoot me a PM if you do this.
     
  5. kscathunter

    kscathunter New Member

    Messages:
    2,367
    State:
    Louisburg,
    Shoot xringer3 a pm with your question and i bet he will have the answer you need. hes the most knolagable abu guy i think ive seen on here and he seems like pretty nice guy, should help with your problem. :wink:
     
  6. cmyers

    cmyers New Member

    Messages:
    18
    State:
    WV
    Unfortunately I'm still new to Catfish1 and I don't have enough posts to PM anyone yet.

    KD thanks for the info. Yes, those are the schematics for my reel. Mike's, the same place you found the schematic, says that it can be done and didn't mention anything about boring out a boss or anything. The parts are cheap enough that I just might give it a try and see how it goes.

    Whistler I'd be happy to take photos and try to put together a 'how to' if it works. Sounds like I might have the one reel where this won't work though without changing out the entire side plate.

    cm
     
  7. Ken D

    Ken D New Member

    Messages:
    160
    State:
    B.C. (CAD)
    Acknowledged, CM.... I suggest you re-check with Mike about your reel...and advise exactly what version you have. As I mentioned, above, IAR is not available for your version, for the reasons mentioned above.

    IAR _is_ possible on those reels that have a little black plastic 'barrel', with the belleville washers on the _top_ of the black barrel bushing, and not underneath it. Or: to replace an existing IAR system that went sour.
    A typical schematic: "Seethe attachment below" Note the position of the bellevilles, and the new part number for the crank bearing/spacer.

    If you change out your side plate for a more current one, yuppers.
    There are several vendors on Eeb, Eh? that part out 4-5-6 Abus on a daily basis, where you can buy _both_ side plates for under 6.00.
    Red plates are low budget, silver ones are more. Same plate, just different anodizing.

    A replacement IAR bearing is a finicky install, without custom tooling, or a "McGyver" approach, with allen bolts, sockets, and wrenches.

    The sideplates offered on the auction site have the brg already installed, so all you would need would be the driveshaft spacer, also available for about half-retail on eeb, eh.

    Hope this re-helps. Best, KD.
     

    Attached Files:

  8. cmyers

    cmyers New Member

    Messages:
    18
    State:
    WV
    KenD - I replied to Mike's email saying that it could be done and gave him the specific info that you provided about needing to bore the boss etc. "Metto" was the one that actually sent the email saying that it would work...we'll see what the response is but it sounds like you know your stuff and this upgrade won't work without replacing a side plate.

    I'll keep you posted.


    cm
     
  9. cmyers

    cmyers New Member

    Messages:
    18
    State:
    WV
    I'm looking at your schematic, but honestly I'm finding it a bit difficult to translate what those parts really are. I'm just now getting into these Abu's, and from the schematics you can't tell the difference between a bearing and a bushing for instance unless you're familiar with the part numbers.

    Is there a listing somewhere that helps with this translation? Or does it kind of just have to come with experience?

    Thanks!
     
  10. Ken D

    Ken D New Member

    Messages:
    160
    State:
    B.C. (CAD)
    Acknowledged, CM.... Metto (pronounced mee'-toe) is most often correct. However: Abu version 99-07 is when and where the IAR was introduced.

    Mike has engineered and fabricated a "bearing basher" to re-affix torn bosses on IAR reels. Strong hooksets with overlined reels, at worst,tend to rip the boss off the side plate, and at best, loosen it pretty good.

    It's a permanent fix, saving the rodster the time waiting, and the expense of a fresh side plate.

    I bought one, and am very pleased with it's performance.

    ps: I caught your post , and hopefully you are OK with the answer. best, KD
     
  11. cmyers

    cmyers New Member

    Messages:
    18
    State:
    WV
    KD - I can't find the "bearing basher" that you're talking about. Is it a tool? Or a custom side plate?

    cm
     
  12. Ken D

    Ken D New Member

    Messages:
    160
    State:
    B.C. (CAD)
    Hi, CM....Abu kept it simple, and global. Pretty much anyone on the planet can read Arabic numbers from 1-0, but not everybody can read the printed word in whatever language. The expense, and packing of schematics and brochures for the world market would add a fair chunk of change to the price.

    A fairly easy way to obtain the nomenclature is to visit a site that sells parts, like Southwestern, or Mikes, and type the pn in the "box" to get the description, and the price.

    This need be done only a few times, as Abu keeps a lot of core parts common through time, and through models.
     
  13. Ken D

    Ken D New Member

    Messages:
    160
    State:
    B.C. (CAD)
    It's a special tool Mike commissioned, and had his machinist make. It's under 100.00, and for the average rodster, who would only hurt a reel or two, not really needed.

    In America, it's no big deal to buy another sideplate, because of the lower costs, and speedy delivery. But out of the country, it's a different game altogether.

    I live in a small (under 5200) community, removed from the mainstream. Mike's is 14 hours drive away, and 3 days each way by mail.

    I can repair a reel and have it fishing again in a few days, saving our sports the time-lag when sending to Mike, and putting it in his queue.
    Plus the savings of the postage for both legs of the ride.

    His wait-time in busy season will be about 3-4 weeks, because of his volume.
     
  14. cmyers

    cmyers New Member

    Messages:
    18
    State:
    WV
    Gotcha. Since I'll likely only encounter a few Abu's of my own, maybe I can start a spreadsheet or something and make my own part number to description cross reference. I just didn't know if maybe somebody else had already done something like that or not.

    cm
     
  15. Ken D

    Ken D New Member

    Messages:
    160
    State:
    B.C. (CAD)
    Kewl....one good thing about this thread: your post count is increasing, and private messages will be yours in no time !!:smile2:

    The folks on another site have a thread where the fellow who was waaaaay more pc savvy than I'll ever be, re-did a schematic in Adobe Acrobat, removing the part numbers, and replacing them with nomenclature. I'll see if I can find the thread, and advise. It was quite a while back, so I may not get it quick.

    KD
     
  16. Ken D

    Ken D New Member

    Messages:
    160
    State:
    B.C. (CAD)
    Found it. It's in the new thread. KD. here it is below:
     

    Attached Files:

  17. cmyers

    cmyers New Member

    Messages:
    18
    State:
    WV
    Hmmm...I *do* have access to Adobe Acrobat, and other software that might be able to get the job done. Maybe I'll give it a go on a couple schematics that I'll likely use and see how it comes out.

    Don't know that I want to get caught up in labeling ALL of those schematics though! :eek:oooh:

    cm
     
  18. cmyers

    cmyers New Member

    Messages:
    18
    State:
    WV
    After hashing things over & over...it looks like 6500C3 with the 99-05 foot number is one that can't be upgraded to IAR without compromising the integrity of the right hand side plate, so I won't be doing this with my reel.

    Another option is to purchase a new side plate from a compatible reel that already has the IAR bearing installed (or at least can accept it without modifications to the boss). I may pursue that in the future. If so I may document that process in case it would be of help to others, but as far as the original upgrade that I'd started this thread about...it ain't happening with this reel.

    Thanks ya'll!
    cm
     
  19. Ken D

    Ken D New Member

    Messages:
    160
    State:
    B.C. (CAD)
    CM, nice to see another Abu nut diving right in. One thing when it comes to installation of an IAR bearing in a plate that's "fittable"....ensure that the bearing is installed for whatever crank you are looking for. If you want rh crank, then the bearing needs to be installed for rh. If you want lh, then it's the other way round.

    While not having done it myself, I did hear much weeping, wailing, and gnashing of teeth, when the rodster installed the bearing wrong.

    You can source the bearing several ways, including a Chicago branch of Motion Industries, Jack Erskine in Australia, Mike at Mike's Reel, or re/re
    (remove and remount) from a donor Abu side plate.

    It's about 10.00 USD to buy a fresh brg.

    You can usually get a good used plate from
    fleabag for about 5, and stamps. Look for the "o-n-e" plates when they come up.

    I have a dedicated tool for re/re, but it's easy to make a 'puller' with an Allen head capscrew, a 3/8 drive socket, 2 flat washers, and a nut for the Allen capscrew.
     
  20. Whistler

    Whistler Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,084
    State:
    TN
    Guys, I removed all references to other forums in this thread. Our rules say we can't link to other commercial sites, especially if they have forums. I did download and add all the schematics you were talking about. Take a look and let me know if it's OK like I've changed it. Thanks, it's a very good subject and one I'd love to see done so I can add it to our library.