30 30 WINCHESTER

Discussion in 'Guns - Blackpowder' started by r ward, Sep 15, 2009.

  1. r ward

    r ward New Member

    Messages:
    2,954
    State:
    Kathleen G
    My son just got me a used 30 30 Winchester lever action with scope my question is what is a good way to sight it in it seems to shoot high
     
  2. 223reload

    223reload New Member

    Messages:
    10,798
    State:
    Oklahoma
    Rich,what I'd do is make a gunvice from a stout cardboard box. Make a cradle for the forearm and buttstock. then cut a hole big enough to reach in and cycle the action. Set it up so you can see the target your shooting at and draw or put a stick on bull on it. Then shoot three rounds . After the first three rounds are fired,measure to the CENTER of that group,from the center of the bull,both hor . and vert.this will be the distance needed to center it on the bullseye.
     

  3. Poppa

    Poppa New Member

    Messages:
    1,233
    State:
    Pinson, Al
    What Richard said. But before you begin make sure your eye relief is
    correct. (Cheek the stock so it is comfortable then slide your face forward
    and back to see if your field of view increases.) If your field of view changes
    loosen your rings and move your scope forward or back until you get the
    best picture. Tighten it down there tighten each side equaly. Make sure
    your scope is tight before you start sighting in.
     
  4. NJ CLAD

    NJ CLAD New Member

    Messages:
    196
    State:
    Arizona
    Start at about 25 yards. Remember you will have to move your scope 4X as many clicks, since they are calibrated to a hundred yards. After you get it on at 25 yards move out to a hundred, it will be close, and finish sighting in.
     
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2009
  5. Paraguayguy

    Paraguayguy New Member

    Messages:
    1,650
    State:
    Virginia
    I just sighted in a new to me used 308 winchester barrel for my Encore rifle. I had bought a used Burris 4 X 12 power scope for $75 at a gun auction here in VA last winter. Our local sporting goods did a bore sight adjustment that basically insures you will hit paper at 25 yards.

    Yesterday was sweet. I took my rifle to one of the nice free state ranges. I shot five times at 25 yards tweaking after each shot. I have one of those gun vice clamping down sighting in deals that eliminates all shooter error. Best $125 I ever spent.

    Moved the target to 100 yards which is max at the state ranges. I shot the rest of the box of cheapo walmart Winchester Super X shells. At a 100 yards I got a nice group about 1 and 1/2 inches spread. Not super, My 243 barrel shoots better but I think with a better bullet and a little experimenting with loads, I will draw that in to less than an inch.

    Now after I have rambled on and on and on,,,,,,Does the deer really care? You have a pie plate sized area on his chest that when you hit there, that deer is now supper. And 100 yards? I hunt the woods mainly over here in Virginia and of the 100's of deer I have shot through the years, I can only think of a handful that were more than 50 yards, most were under 25 yards

    You will love your 30-30. My first deer rifle was a Winchester Model 94. I bought it at Kmart on sale as a "Blue Light Special" for $68 in 1970. Thankfully I was there with my older brother as I was 16 at the time and couldn't have bought it without him. I still have the Rifle and it is still killing deer. I never put a scope on it. She shoots just fine without one.
     
  6. countryboy79

    countryboy79 New Member

    Messages:
    358
    State:
    nc
    All rite they told you how to set your sites. I'am gonna tell you the best bullets to use. The Hornady Leverevolution bullets for a 30-30 are bad _ss. The bullet only drops 0.2'' at 200 yards. There aint a nother 30-30 bullet that can do that. I shot my rifle 5 times last year i killed 3 deer and 2 bobcats. 1 shot 1 kill.
     
  7. kyelkhunter3006

    kyelkhunter3006 New Member

    Messages:
    1,192
    State:
    Ky

    Hell yeah. That load totally redefines the 30-30 round. Makes it a 250 yard deer round EASILY. I've shot them in several guns, and they all shot it better than the traditional loads. It gets my vote for the BEST 30-30 LOAD OF ALL TIME.
     
  8. brinley45cal

    brinley45cal Active Member

    Messages:
    2,606
    State:
    kentucky
    At what range is it shooting high?
     
  9. kyelkhunter3006

    kyelkhunter3006 New Member

    Messages:
    1,192
    State:
    Ky
    30-30 Win 160 gr FTX LEVERevolution
    82730​






    Velocity (fps) / Energy (ft-lbs)
    Muzzle 2400/2046
    100 yd 2150/1643
    200 yd 1916/1304
    300 yd 1699/1025


    Trajectory (inches)
    Muzzle -1.73
    100 yd 3.0
    200 yd 0.2
    300 yd -12.1
     
    Last edited: Sep 17, 2009
  10. bootshowl

    bootshowl New Member

    Messages:
    2,288
    State:
    Indiana, J
    R Ward, don't laugh, but if ya don't have a bench or range with a bench, you can use an ironing board as a pretty stable platform. The better older ones adjust for the woman's height. Adjust it for your seat, and bag the barrel at the business end, and it's pretty darn stable, supporting your rifle arm and shoulder. The smaller rounded end lets you conform yer body close to center, with the bore centered along it's length.
    If ya need shooting bags, they can be made from old jeans legs, cut off below the knee. If the wife will machine stitch the first seam for ya, take sand or kitty litter and hand stitch the bag closed after it's full.
    (Don't try getting sand or kitty litter round the sewing machine...or you'll end up buying her a new one, LOL.)

    Guess you can tell I'm a poor boy.
    :wink:
     
  11. kyelkhunter3006

    kyelkhunter3006 New Member

    Messages:
    1,192
    State:
    Ky
    That type of stuff works just about as well as a $$$ bench set-up does. Most of my bags are extra-long socks filled with kitty litter and perlite or vermiculite (I can't remember which one, one is dusty, one isn't??). :smile2:
     
  12. phase5supply

    phase5supply New Member

    Messages:
    126
    State:
    Hope Mills, NC
    I made a bag and filled it wit cat litter, it work great but was dusty, it got wet and turned very hard. I order a 10 lb bag of BB sized plastic balls ( they where cheap shipping cost as much a BB's ) I have a shooting bag filled with them, it is very light easy to tote around and works fine. If it gets wet it will not bother it.
     
  13. Kip Brandel

    Kip Brandel New Member

    Messages:
    502
    State:
    Glasgow, Kentuc
    Not to start anything but your info is off. WAY OFF.
    At the muzzle it is -1.7 inches, at 100 yds it is 3 inches high, at 200 yds it is .2 inches low and at 300 yds it is 12.1 inches low. This means it drops 3.2 inches from 100-200 yds. It also coverd an area of 5 inches form the barrel to the 200 yd target. If you sited the gun for a 100yd zero you would be slightly more than 5 inches low at 200 due to the trajectory for the round.

    If you look at some of the other ammo, Winchester, Remington etc they all use 100, 150 or 200 yd zeros on there graphs. I am not sure why Hornady used a 180 yd zero other than the fact to say they were only down .2 inches at 200. Creative advertising I guess.
    Remember that the bullets path is not liner and that if you fire it up hit to start it will not drop as far at first BUT will drop sooner the farther you get form the barrel so starting it off 3 inches high at 100 = .2 low at 200 BUT put it at zero at 100 and you will more than likely be over 5 inches low at 200 but this, while still really good would not be as good of an advertising gimmick.
    Hornady dose a better job explaining this on there own web site.
    http://www.hornady.com/ballistics/external.php
    If you use there numbers for Velocity, Ballistic Coefficient and Bullet weight on there ballistics calculator zeroed at 100 yds it plots the trajectory as follows.
    Muzzle = -1.5 inches
    50 yds = +.1 inches
    100 yds = 0.0 inches
    200 yds = -5.7 inches
    So at 200 yds it dropped almost 6 inches which is about the same as the 150 grain Winchester Super X hollow point and Silver tip at a little over 7.7 inches, The 150 grain Remington Core-lokt at 7.6, Hornady 150gr RN at 7.7 and Federals soft point flat nose at 7.2 inches.
    Now these are lighter cartridges BUT they are also NOT spire points and have a worse ballistic coefficient.

    Older lever actions seemed to have problems with the original run of these bullets and were patterning them like a shot gun, my 94 Winchester is one of them. I got MUCH better results single loading a Winchester 165 grain Ballistic Silver tip in the gun which resulted in 2 inch groups at 100yds with a 4 power scope. The Hornady ammo left the side of the 8X11 target on several shots. They have changed them sense but I have not tried them to see what and if it helped but for awhile the only guns that they seemed to work well in were the newer Marlin lever action rifles. A friend had one and the same loads that were junk in mine were 1 -1.5 inch groups at 100 yds.

    Hope this helps.
     
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2009
  14. Kip Brandel

    Kip Brandel New Member

    Messages:
    502
    State:
    Glasgow, Kentuc
    I have used old jeans legs and aquarium rocks. I bought a few bags of the rocks at a yard sale for $1 and made 4 shooting bags from them. They are CHEAP and it really doesnt matter if they get wet. (Read that last part as we used them to chock the boat trailer tires once!)
     
  15. flathead willie

    flathead willie Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,241
    State:
    Virginia
    Also check the barrel crowning. I bought a used Ruger .357 several years ago that shot high no matter what I did. I had the barrel re-crowned and it shot perfectly after that. It's amazing what one little burr will do.
     
  16. Mark J

    Mark J New Member

    Messages:
    9,407
    State:
    Four Oaks, NC
    I wouldn't put alot of stock in those graphs and tables. Too many variables in "real world" that can have an effect on actual results.
    In some cases those tables won't even be in the ball park.
     
  17. Mark J

    Mark J New Member

    Messages:
    9,407
    State:
    Four Oaks, NC
    Easist way to sight in is with a 5 shot group.
    Fire 5 shots at 100 yards.
    Take the shot that strays the most out of the group and discard it.

    Take an average of the rest of the group and adjust your scope from that group to the center of the target.

    Check fire. You may need to fine tune a little more.
    Use a graphed target. Makes it simple and easy.

    I wouldn't even make the first scope correction until I could get a decent group. If you can't group consistently you'll chase a sight in all over the paper. If you can't group consistently you havea firearm issue or either you need to dismount the scope and remount using blue or green tite loc on your screws. You may have something to do with the mount moving around.

    There is absolutely no reason it should take a box of shells to sight a scope in if you are on paper already.
     
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2009
  18. flathead willie

    flathead willie Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,241
    State:
    Virginia
    I've always used the old military method of starting with a 1,000 inch target range. The bullet hits "0" on the upward side of the trajectory at 1,000 inches, and hits very close to "0" on the down hill side of the trajectory at 100 yards. It can easily be fine tuned from there. It saves a lot of ammo if the scope is new or it is hitting off the paper at 100 yards.
     
  19. trnsmsn

    trnsmsn New Member

    Messages:
    1,214
    State:
    Missouri Originally Now I

    What about bullet weight retention & mushrooming capabilities ??
     
  20. Kip Brandel

    Kip Brandel New Member

    Messages:
    502
    State:
    Glasgow, Kentuc
    The bullets ballistic coefficient and the velocity are actually pretty close to actual results. When putting shots down range through my chrono I have found that the ballistic charts are pretty close. My personal range is 350yds right now but I am working on making it 400 before the end of the year.