Where are the Shad hiding at in Missouri?

[NoCat2Big]

I must have thrown my cast next a thousand times over the past couple of weeks on LOZ and Truman and all I'm ending up with is a few gills and some crappie.

Some of the other folks I run into while fishing have had to go clear to montrose to get any.

Most of the spots I catch them this time of year are coming up dry.

any suggestions would be appreciated.

[Mr.T]

Did you try the harbor at Warsaw?

[aaronm283]

i throwed at the harbor for 2 hours the other day didnt catch a thing. went to a pond and throwed 5 times and had over 30 big shad

[Mr.T]

It's not really close to Warsaw, but I usually go to the city pond in Windsor for my shad (Dad lives in Windsor and I always have to go through there to pick him up)

The shad are so thick in the summer that you can almost walk across the pond. Don't know what they're like this time of year, though - we put about 12 bags of them in the freezer last October and have been working through them since then.

The pond is in the city park - when you come into town from the east on Hwy 52, turn left on County Line Rd. (at the bowling alley) and go another mile or so and you'll run right into it on your left. It's called "Farrington Park" and the pond is managed by the MDC. Or you can go to the 4-way stop in the middle of town and go south for 5 or 6 blocks - the road curves to your left but you'll eventually end up in the park.

[Bigmagic]

It matters what time of day your going after the shad. In the mornings they seem to be stacking up on the river channel edges. Very easy to get with a large fast sinking net. As the day goes on they move shallow and are more scatterd along the shallow mud flats here on LOZ. I threw my net twice yesterday and had all I needed. Good sonar earns it price when the shad are tough to find. As for Drake harbor if there is any current there are shad in there. If the dam isn't releasing water the shad move out to the channel edges from the mouth of Drake up to about the bathrooms. If you have a boat and the right net you can get shad in or near Drake Harbor most days.

I understand your frustration, before I got my Lowrance X97 and X15 I used the old standby windblown bank and gulls or cumarans. Now I have learned to use a combination of my Lowrance and my Hummingbird 3d to locate them. My hummingbird shows shad schools as mountains or peaks rising up from the bottom not as fish. Sometimes the Lowrance misses them completely or shows them as a ball or part of the bottom. Using a combination of the two I can usually find them. Boat control is kind of tough when I'm by myself but if my son-n-law is along he tosses the net and I keep him over the shad. Another dead give away on your sonar is when the bottom readout is say 25ft but on the unit itself the bottom goes up to around 10 to 15 ft. Thats a dead give away that the false bottom is shad. Do not expect large schools of shad to show up as fish! The larger the school the less likely they are to appear as fish on your sonar. Jeff Williams taught me that and experience with my sonar has taught me a lot as well. See ya on the water!

[Itch2Scratch]

Thats some excellent usable information Ron, Thanks!.:)

[Burwell40]

I met Jeff Williams one day last November when I was fishing with Steve Brown. We had just gotten new Lowrance GPS fishfinders before we went to Mo (I'm from near Iowa City, IA). The first thing Steve did was adjust our fish finders' sensitivity. After we went out that day and came back to his lodge, Steve asked, "Did you see any bait clouds?". I hooted, "That's what those were!". On my color display, the shad would show up as big yellow balls or, as described earlier, a mountain rising from the bottom.

This completely changed my outlook on "shad getting". All winter long I've been anxiously awaiting a chance to try and locate shad in our local Coralville Reservoir. We struggle every spring with locating shad in time for a couple of tournaments that are held up here in the spring. Well, yesterday, I went out with my wife to do some scouting. Sure enough after some tooling around, I saw some bait. At first, I was getting only a few per netfull. Later, I checked across the lake and saw the mother of all bait clouds. I made a crappy throw (the net didn't even open all the way) and pulled in a big netfull! After that, I just kept looking for more bait and discovered a pattern that the shad were following that day. I found several more bait clouds and threw the net just enought to confirm that there were, indeed, shad there. After that, I didn't throw any more but just kept finding more bait. My next order of business is to get a bigger net. If I'm getting 5 or 6 shad with a 6 footer, I might as well be getting 2 dozen with a 12 footer.


Mike.

[Bigmagic]

Get a big net and get two hundred on a good throw. I don't have color sonar but I've seen Jeff's and its even more obvious with them. I have an 8ft diameter and a 20ft diameter net with 1/2 mesh that sinks fast and works well in deep water. I have even figured out how to throw it without giving myself a heart attack. I can't stress enough to anyone how important a good sonar unit is. Its worth the extra bucks you spend on it. Yes it has a learning curve but after a while you'll recognize a lot more than bait location. Fish habitat is repeated over and over and the same areas hold fish over and over.
Once you can consistantly get good bait and find the current breaks your well on your way to making catfishing look easy. See ya on the water.

[Hannibal Mike]

I have a lowrance/gps that I use on the missi and I never see balls of shad. Now, sensitivity is a bit tough on the river due to floating leaves, dirt, etc. I did not think of rising bottom peaks! Even when I am getting shad, my sonar seldom registers shad. I was throwing a 6 or 8 foot net and just bought a 16' dia for deeper water. It is still 3/8ths square, but I hope to do better with your help! I usually go shallow and look for the fish hitting the surface. Thanks again for helpful tips. Hannibal Mike

[Burwell40]

Bigmagic...

How DO you throw that big net without having a heart attack?

[Bigmagic]

I used a method where I roll the rope and the net up, split the net in halves and then lift a line or two of the net of into my right hand I then spin the net out of my hands crossing my right hand over my left. It sounds complicated but I have a video I could send ya on how to do it.
I am going to shoot some video over the next couple of weeks on getting shad. I'll either post it or show it at the gathering. I'll include examples of shad on sonar and attempt to explain some theorys and tips about finding shad. I don't promise Bill Dance but I'll try to make sense. See ya on the water!

[Burwell40]

I watched the video by the auzzie. Is the the method?

[Burwell40]

BigMagic

Your 20' diameter would be what dealers call a 10 ft net, right? And 1/2" mesh?

[Bigmagic]

Yes the Aussie and a 10ft Radius net. Expensive but once again worth it.

[beeheck]

Ron, no guarantee of Bill Dance, does that mean no bloopers?

[SeedTick]

Hi Guys, I just got a new Lowrance depth finder and haven't had a chance to use it yet and I have a question. When you see shad on the graph where do you throw? It has a duel frequency transducer, 35 degree and 12 degree, I know it only covers so much area and the area gets bigger the deeper the water gets. What I don't understand is where exactly are the targets in relation to the boat.
Thanks in advance
ST

[Burwell40]

SeedTick that's a darn good question and I'm not sure I know the answer.

I'm assuming that if you see the bait cloud under your transducer which is more than likely on the stern, you should throw off the back. However, I'm not sure how much the bait will scatter from the motor passing over them. I had my wife driving the boat and she's not experienced enough to stop the boat on a cast. Therefore, out of necessity, I was casting off the front of the boat and drifting over my net drop in neutral. This is actually throwing blind though since I dont' really know what's under the front of the boat. I've considered using my trolling motor to more closely control my speed and direction and also to be quieter.

BigMagic, we need your experience and expertise to guide us!!!

[Bigmagic]

I will be able to respond soon. I'm working on another matter. I owe someone an apology.

[safetybass]

There's nothing like the sound of the big motor going over to scatter shallow shad or send them deep. Trolling motor will always be a better option. Keep in mind there is a delay between your transducer "seeing" the shad ball and displaying it. It may only be a second, but if you are idling along at 4 mph, that's 21120 feet per hour,divided by 60 = 352 feet per minute. That is approximately 6 feet per second. In other words, by the time you see the shad on your depthfinder, they would be 6 feet behind your transducer angle which initially identified them. If you have a 12 degree cone, assumed to be straight down, shad 10 feet down would be a maximum of 1.5 feet in front of the cone center. That means, at 10 feet down, they are 4.5 feet behind your transducer when you see them. 1 second later, they are 10 feet behind your transducer. If it is located 2 feet in front of your transom, they are 8 feet behind your boat 1 second after you saw them on your screen. The best option is to slow down and reduce the travel distance from sighting to net throw. At the same time, the reduced noise of a trolling motor is less likely to cause them to dive or scatter sideways.

[Bigmagic]

Usually shad congregate in the same areas so there will be more than one school in the area. Sometimes however they will stack on a channel edge in one gigantic school. I haven't found them to be near as spooky in this situation. If you are into multiple balls of shad or one large group they tend to not be as skidish as a single smaller school or a scattered school. There are a lot of factors that influence this condition just be aware of it when looking for shad. Small schools scare easy, large ones not as easy. There is Safetybass in numbers.lol

[safetybass]

OK. That was cute!

[Burwell40]

I was able to duplicate my shad-getting feat yesterday. I think part of my problem is that my net isn't sinking fast enough. I'll either need to invest in a new net or add weight to mine. I was able to determine that the shad are holding between 10 and 15 feet depth and are thicker when there's a 15 foot bottom. I'll be interested to see how that pattern holds. Surface temp up here is 42 deg. right now.

BigMagic, what size mesh do you use?

Interesting thing...I figured out why a less than wide open net was getting more shad. The net would sink faster when less than wide open!

Lastly, now that I've had some experience with this color fish finder, I'm really impressed with the details I'm able to see.

Mike.

[Burwell40]

For what it's worth, I got my new 8' 5/8" mesh net. I'm gonna try it out this weekend and see if I can get 200 like Bigmagic does. I'll let you all know how it goes.

[SeedTick]

Let us know. I am keeping an eye of this post to.

ST

[safetybass]

Burwell: just be careful. If you're a fishin' by yourself you'll need to throw back 50 out of them 200. I believe 150 is the limit.

[Bigmagic]

I'm going out with my daughter this morning so I'll be gathering bait also. I use its either a 1/2 or 5/8 mesh 10ft radius net. It sinks faster than those Wally world nets and is good up to around 25 or 30ft. Lately I've been able to get shad on the channel edge in about 14ft of water. Keep working with that sonar its really the key to catching shad consistantly.
I did tell my daughter to bring her digital camera so I could get some stills of the sonar. Heck I might evern drag my video camera(na not till after the tourney). See ya on the water!

[Bigmagic]

Well I kind of promised some pictures of the sonar showing shad and I had mixed results. The pictures of the Lowrance X97 show a huge school of shad similar to what I have elaborated on in the past. In the first photo other species are mixed with the shad probably feeding. In the second photo you can see the fish trailing the mountain of shad. The blurred photo's of the Hummingbird show the peaks which are also shad. I have included a picture of the Magic man untangling the nets as a result of pulling the boat up to refuel without the nets put away properly. Notice the two different sizes of nets very important. I hope you get an idea of what to look for with various sonar devices out there. As soon as I can get someone to operate the boat or the net I will do an in depth video on gathering shad. See ya on the water!

[STICKBENDER]

I want to see photo's

[STICKBENDER]

i Want To See Photo's

[Bigmagic]

If you mean of the shad I should have taken some. I only kept about twenty and I probably still have a few left alive in my boat. The shad were around 5 or 6 inches long not my favorite size but adequate for a day of fishing. I could not get my 8ft diameter net to catch these shad. It closes at about 8 to 10ft. These shad were on the windblown side of the lake on a small flat in 13 to 16ft of water. I suspect that white bass were trailing them since there are a couple of tail tell signs in the photos of the graph and the flat was near the mouth of a creek channel. I should also mentioned we returned to this flat later in the day and it was bare! Nothing nada empty! My daughter couldn't operate my boat and couldn't throw the net. When I brought the shad in she was taking pictures of the sonar. To be continued!

[Bigmagic]

Here's the peaks I talked about with the Hummingbird 3D. Excuse the quality I took it and I was too close. The peaks are shad.

[SeedTick]

Ron, I sure appreciate the pictures. I'm needing to get on the water so I can see if I've retained any of what I think I have learned? hehe

ST

[bsu_catfisher]

I'm no pro at this topic, but my buddies and I have always had good luck in this creek that we launch into. The section of the creek from the ramp to the river is pertty shallow most of the way and is a no wake so. As we creep along we throw up around the shallower areas closer to the banks. If we really aren't seeing any we will increase the speed of the boat up a little and they will start jumping out of the water. When they start jumping we slow way back if not back to neutral and throw imediately at the spot they were jumping at. This system seems to work really well for us and have caught alot this way. Just some food for thought.

[Bigmagic]

Eean I do the same thing later in the year. The photo's I took show large groups of very skiddish shad who have moved onto a small flat in a creek mouth. In the summer I doubt you could get such large schools on your graph in such shallow water(13 to 16ft). We went back later and there were no fish or anything on the graph. Notice in the Lowrance pictures that the bottom is reading out around 15 ft and the shad extend up to the 10ft mark. Notice also that there is a distinct difference between the bottom and the next layer. That next layer is shad and in this case there are fish above them. I threw a net last week and got a netful of small shad and crappie in a similar situation. The almost bottom like look of these shad appear as they often do on river channel edges in deeper water. The wind was blowing so hard today the shad were forced to one side of the lake and onto these flats. They were very skiddish and would spook easily. I hope by the end of spring to have an in depth video on the finding and taking of shad, including the method you describe which is one I use myself a little later in the year. See ya on the water!

[bsu_catfisher]

Ron, can't wait to see the video.

[Burwell40]

Ron, that is really some great stuff. I'll see if I'm smart enough to attach a photo from my sonar...it has a recording feature.

This sonar log was taken after I had already passed over the school and they're a lot more scattered. My first pass looked more like Ron's screen except the school shows up all yellow. I'l try to get better pictures this weekend.

[Mountain Cur]

Has anyone tried using a "side vision" unit in shallow water to locate shad?

[Mr.T]

Great information, Ron! Keep it coming.

What kind of bait tank do you use for keeping the shad alive?

I take it from your comments that you not only have to be able to throw a big net, but you have to be able to throw it well so that it completely opens up -- I've got a 5' radius net and am lucky if I can get it to open more than maybe 2/3 when I throw it. So I assume that by the time it gets down 15 ft or so, it's all balled up and that's why I'm not getting any shad?

I *really* have to learn from you guys about throwing a net -- I understand that it's about throwing form more than about being able to muscle it out, but I just can't seem to get the hang of it. I also have a bad shoulder (tore a tendon last summer throwing the baseball to my son) so don't really have the strength to throw it very hard. I think learning to finesse it is my only hope...

[SeedTick]

This is some good stuff guys. Bigmagic a video will really help us understand. You da Man.

Burwell40, What kind of sonar do you have? I just got a Lowrance x107cdf that I ain't got to use yet. I bet that is what shad will look like on it.

Thank you guys for the info.

ST

[SeedTick]

Mr. T, I just got me a smaller net this week hoping it will be easier to throw. I can throw my bigger one from the bank but it seems like I always tangle it up with something in the boat. The one I got was a cheap 5 footer from Walmart. I have an old one that is about shot and if I can throw this little one better I'm gonna cannibalize it and put the weights on the new one.

ST

[SeedTick]

correction, it's a 4 footer - 8 foot diameter

[Bigmagic]

I got to thinking about a couple of things I haven't mentioned. One is you should always take note of the wind direction, wind speed, overcast or sunny, current or non current conditions. Shad will repeatedly be in the same places over and over again so you should be able to pattern them in your particular area. You will learn so much more about catching catfish when you learn about shad movements pretty soon you'll have a pretty good idea where Old Blue is based on what the shad are doing.

As far as keeping them alive its very easy this time of year and very hard in the summer. I use a cut down 50 gallon plastic drum.(cut to about 25 gallon or less). The container must be round and don't overdo it on the shad. In the summer add some pickling salt or shad keep to the water and change ir often. A lot of the top guides have went to just keeping the shad on ice in a cooler, some use a baggy to keep them in. If you want to Hybrid or Striper fish or use live bait for cats you'll have to have a round tank with arator to keep them alive.

I hook my shad heads and live shad thru the nostrils and the gut pack once back up thru the belly. I hope this thread has got everyone in the mood to go locate them shad! Get excited go learn and pretty soon you'll spend more time fishing and less time hunting bait. See ya on the water!

[SeedTick]

Bigmagic, You keep teaching and I'll keep learning........well I'll keep paying attention. I hope some of it stays. hehe

Thanks and keep it coming

ST

[Burwell40]

I found them yesterday. Broke in my new 8' net. The biggest I had thrown before was 6'. When I came across the shad showing in the attached pictures, I got so excited that I screwed up about 5 throws in a row...and I've been throwing for 15 years! Anyway, I finally got the wind at my back and had a big open throw and had more bait than I needed.

One of the attachments shows sonar giving false bottom reading and changing scale because it thinks the shad are the bottom.

Mike.

[Burwell40]

Seed Tick, my unit is a Lowrance LMS-332, a combo gps fish finder. I meant to add that to earlier post. We're supposed to be able to edit posts, but I don't see an edit button.

The guide I had down at Truman was showing me fish arches amongst the shad. I'm wondering if, when the shad are as thick as the earlier sonar pictures indicate, I'll be able to see game fish feeding among the bait fish. Maybe I can adjust sensitivity or something. Anyone have any thoughts?

[Bigmagic]

Great photos! I almost upgraded to color this year but I decided to stick with what I have at least one more year. I have an LCX 15 MT with GPS that I use just as a GPS. I added it last year. I have a X-97 and a Hummingbird 3D. I'm glad you had success and understand the whole shad as a false bottom thing. This is such an interesting topic and a very basic one to all catfisherman. The first thing you have to have is bait. Less time spent chasing bait equals more time spent fishing. See ya on the water.

[Mr.T]

Hey Ron -- can either of your sonars record the data like the LMS-332? Many of the higher-end units can, but you need a memory card to record onto. The Lowrance/Eagle units have a matching Windows program to play back the recorded information. If your unit can do the recording, it sure beats trying to take pictures of the unit at just the right time -- just let it record and then play it back when you get home.

My Eagle FishElite 480 can record, I'm just too stupid to remember to turn it on before I see something interesting -- if I would have had my head screwed on straight today, I would have recorded several things I saw, mostly to get some confirmation that what I saw was what I think I saw... Next time, I'll remember...

[Mr.T]

Burwell -- did you find the 8 ft net easier to throw than the 6 ft? I've always heard they get easier but have never tried anything bigger than 5 ft. And I stink trying to use that size for sure...

[SeedTick]

I don't know about you guys but I think this is becoming library material.

ST

[SeedTick]

Mr.T You got me to thinking I couldn't remember if mine recorded info or not. I looked at so many before I got it I just couldn't remember. Guess what, it does, from manual "build-in memory stores sonar records for decades". I have read every page in that manual twice and flipped through it bunches and don't remember seeing it before. I know what I'll be doing in a few minuets, reading it again.

ST

[Bigmagic]

Yes my LCX 15 MT can record for playback. I will have a lot more follow up in the video. I am going fishing again Tuesday if I get over this cold. The winds are supposed to be light(Normally I like lots of wind). Saturday I had to beach my boat hard due to low water to get my truck and back my trailer up. I then had a hard time getting it on the trailer practically had to jump it on the trailer. The ramps down here are plum out of the water and the ground is uneven causing a tilted trailer and making it difficult to load the boat in the wind. Once the water gets up no problem but right now its tough. I used today to snell some hooks and lubricate my reels. So not a total loss. If that rain doesn't come tomorrow I may give it a try then. See ya on the water!

[STICKBENDER]

I was wondering if anyone had a video on casting throw net and getting shad?

[STICKBENDER]

Was Wondering If Anyonehad A Vidoe On Catching Shad?

[Bigmagic]

I'll be making one real soon Stickbender. I know a lot of people struggle to find shad and I think I can help. I'll make sure ya get a copy! See ya on the water!

[STICKBENDER]

Big Magic, where can a guy get a good quality throw net, and what size would you recomend.

If you ever get a need to try Mark Twain lake, let me know I can show you around the lake.
I live 3 miles from ramp, and closer yet to the lake.

Stickbender

[Bigmagic]

Bob if you do a search on castnets you'll come up with several to choose from. Walmart is great for smaller nets like the Fitec Super Spreader. It has an aluminum ring which makes for easy opening. Anyone can throw one(I have one myself). For larger nets search the web, I have a Bait Buster 10ft radius that cost me about $100.00 if I remember right. If you come to the gathering I'll let ya take a look at it. I could mention some sites by name but I'm not sure if we have any sponsors who make nets or not. See ya on the water!

[Itch2Scratch]

Catfish Connection(link on far right of page) carries cast nets and is one of our sponsors...they ship FAST!;)

[NoCat2Big]

White Brach cove on LOZ is teaming with shad right now. Nearly every cast nets several.