The mysterious "Lowrance Man"

[tbull]

I have now seen this on a post, and on a video from one of the sponsers to the BOC, someone saying the "Lowrance Man" showed them how to find cats on there graph (Lowrance). Anyone had this experience kind of enough to elaborate a little? I know catfisherman guard their secrets like Fort knox, but we never have traveling shows like that come through Cincinnati. Can anyone shed some light on this? Thanks bros:wink:

[RiverKing]

I would like to know the answer to that too...I hear people say you can tell if its a catfish on the fish finder..HOW??? I hear people say you can watch your screen and watch the fish hit the bait on the fish finder screen HOW???

[tbull]

That is one thing I can say mine will do is show your rigs, and show fish checking it out especially when drifting. But its usually so chaotic on the boat while drifting I dont get to pay much attention to the graph, just watching the depth more than anything..:ooooh:

[biga]

i am a little busy today but i will try to post some screen shots of what it looks like when a fish hits your bait on a fish finder.. also check out the lowrance x135 aticle in the library that deerhunter01 did and he explains how to tell a scaled fish from a smooth skin fish...

[Mr.T]

I hear people say you can tell if its a catfish on the fish finder..HOW???

They can't.

While some fisherman can say with a good degree of confidence that a particular sonar return *might* be a catfish (based mostly on where the return is and what other "stuff" is also showing on the screen), nobody can guarantee it. Nor can they prove it. And if you can't prove it, you're just blowing smoke.

Some say that a scaled fish makes a different return on the sonar than a smooth-sided fish like a catfish. But when you understand how sonar works, you realize that the return is primarily "seeing" the air in the fish's swim bladder; flesh, bones and scales are not much different in density than the water the fish is in, so the sonar beam doesn't bounce. The location of the fish within the "cone" that the sonar can see impacts the strength of the return significantly - a small fish in the center of the cone can make a bigger signature on the screen than a big fish near the edge.

I hear folks here on the BOC all the time talking about how they marked a fish, set up on him and had him in the boat five minutes later. Baloney. They saw *something* on the graph, tossed their bait out and *something* hit it. Same something? Maybe, maybe not. But they can't prove it, at least not to my satisfaction.

You can learn to use sonar to effectively find and target higher-percentage areas that will result in more fish in your boat - I do it all the time with a lot of success - but to say "that's a catfish right there, and I'm going to catch that fish" is just nonsense.

I hear people say you can watch your screen and watch the fish hit the bait on the fish finder screen HOW???

You have to have your bait within the "cone" below the transducer. Try dropping your line right off the back of the boat some time and you can follow it all the way to the bottom. If it stays where the transducer can see it, you might be able to see a fish coming along to take the bait. Ice fishermen do this all the time; catfishermen not so much.

[tbull]

All makes since, sounds like its time to get on the horn to lowrance and get the answer right from the source...:smile2::wink:

[Steve Douglas]

are you talkin bout the guy the other day that says he marks fish then sets up on them plus he can even tell them in the mud?

[JPritch]

I think Mr. T hit the nail on the head and explained better than I ever could. I don't buy the scale vs non-scale argument either.

I have though setup on an arc a couple times and caught a fish. But yeah, I can't guarantee it was that arc that I caught. But at least identifying arcs and throwing in their general direction seems to produce at times.

[tbull]

are you talkin bout the guy the other day that says he marks fish then sets up on them plus he can even tell them in the mud?


Possibly, not sure though, also another video from team catfish a guy says "see now that looks like a scaled fish"....Seems to be 50-50 on people that believe it or not. This is just a piece of an article i read about how sonar works, some may find it interesting that even though it mentions the swim bladder being a reason for a sonar return, it also mentions some other possibilities as well. Read for yourself:

Note: The acoustical properties of the flesh of a fish are very near that of regular water. This means the propagation of sonar waves through a fish are almost indistinguishable from open water. What causes the echo return from a fish is the presence of scales, skin, skeletal structures, and predominantly a swim bladder filled with air. Both fresh and salt water species have these bladders which are filled with air for buoyancy compensation at different depths. Experience has shown that fish that travel depths very quickly like Tuna or Albacore have very small swim bladders which make them more difficult for sonar to obtain good echoes. However other game fish like Bass, Walleye, and even the baitfish they prey upon all have bladders which are detected by sonar sound waves.

[dougc]

I hear folks here on the BOC all the time talking about how they marked a fish, set up on him and had him in the boat five minutes later. Baloney. They saw *something* on the graph, tossed their bait out and *something* hit it. Same something? Maybe, maybe not. But they can't prove it, at least not to my satisfaction.


Still haven't figured out the Humminbird Marty?:big_smile:

As far as marking fish 100 feet out to the side of the boat, never going over the top of them, setting up in front of them and catching them-I've seen it happen. Been in the boat, and caught one of the fish that we marked that way. Might not happen like that all the time, but it can happen.

[RiverKing]

They can't.

While some fisherman can say with a good degree of confidence that a particular sonar return *might* be a catfish (based mostly on where the return is and what other "stuff" is also showing on the screen), nobody can guarantee it. Nor can they prove it. And if you can't prove it, you're just blowing smoke.

Some say that a scaled fish makes a different return on the sonar than a smooth-sided fish like a catfish. But when you understand how sonar works, you realize that the return is primarily "seeing" the air in the fish's swim bladder; flesh, bones and scales are not much different in density than the water the fish is in, so the sonar beam doesn't bounce. The location of the fish within the "cone" that the sonar can see impacts the strength of the return significantly - a small fish in the center of the cone can make a bigger signature on the screen than a big fish near the edge.

I hear folks here on the BOC all the time talking about how they marked a fish, set up on him and had him in the boat five minutes later. Baloney. They saw *something* on the graph, tossed their bait out and *something* hit it. Same something? Maybe, maybe not. But they can't prove it, at least not to my satisfaction.

You can learn to use sonar to effectively find and target higher-percentage areas that will result in more fish in your boat - I do it all the time with a lot of success - but to say "that's a catfish right there, and I'm going to catch that fish" is just nonsense.



You have to have your bait within the "cone" below the transducer. Try dropping your line right off the back of the boat some time and you can follow it all the way to the bottom. If it stays where the transducer can see it, you might be able to see a fish coming along to take the bait. Ice fishermen do this all the time; catfishermen not so much.


Im glad someone said it, cause i never believed it either!!! :crazy:

[dinger66]

jeremy leeach a lowrance pro staffer told me the info on the image detection , so you can take it or leave it . what i have been told . but the lung capasity of the fish will show up red and is deeper on some than others.

[spoonfish]

Reminds me of the guys that set up a tree stand where theres no deer sign and sits in it all season wondering why he didnt get one. :confused2:

Why set up to fish if your not showing any fish on your graph. Unless your setting up on structure of some sort your just hopeing that one will come by sooner or later.

Is what your seeing a catfish or not? If someone can say 100% yes he's going to make a lot of money but by knowing there patterns you can make a pretty good guess.

[GMC FishHauler]

i really trust my Lowrance 17m, it shows me there is something that returns like a fish on my graph. I use it alot in the fall and winter, when the fish are deeper.
I dont really use it much for finding fish in under 10' of water since the cone will be so small at that depth.

[biga]

They can't.

While some fisherman can say with a good degree of confidence that a particular sonar return *might* be a catfish (based mostly on where the return is and what other "stuff" is also showing on the screen), nobody can guarantee it. Nor can they prove it. And if you can't prove it, you're just blowing smoke.

Some say that a scaled fish makes a different return on the sonar than a smooth-sided fish like a catfish. But when you understand how sonar works, you realize that the return is primarily "seeing" the air in the fish's swim bladder; flesh, bones and scales are not much different in density than the water the fish is in, so the sonar beam doesn't bounce. The location of the fish within the "cone" that the sonar can see impacts the strength of the return significantly - a small fish in the center of the cone can make a bigger signature on the screen than a big fish near the edge.

I hear folks here on the BOC all the time talking about how they marked a fish, set up on him and had him in the boat five minutes later. Baloney. They saw *something* on the graph, tossed their bait out and *something* hit it. Same something? Maybe, maybe not. But they can't prove it, at least not to my satisfaction.

You can learn to use sonar to effectively find and target higher-percentage areas that will result in more fish in your boat - I do it all the time with a lot of success - but to say "that's a catfish right there, and I'm going to catch that fish" is just nonsense.



You have to have your bait within the "cone" below the transducer. Try dropping your line right off the back of the boat some time and you can follow it all the way to the bottom. If it stays where the transducer can see it, you might be able to see a fish coming along to take the bait. Ice fishermen do this all the time; catfishermen not so much.

you are really putting this info out here like it is a fact when in reality it is your opinion!!! if the sonar is seeing the air bladder then why do you see a log or other debris in the water without an air bladder lots of things show up as [fish] on sonar? the humminbird tech that i have been talking to while i get my electronics interlinked on my new boat says the same thing about the harder scaled fish giving a different return than the soft skin of a catfish and that is why you see the long strings on the end of the echos of a scales fish! you go and drift thru a school of fish with long echos and see how many cats you pull out of the school of carp or striper or bass whatever it may be!! then drift a school of suspended fish with good solid archs and see how many cats you catch unless you are in an area full of spoonbill there is a good chance they are catfish!!! instead of being so sure you know that you are 100% right and steering someone in the wrong direction take a chance that you might be wrong and you might learn somthing that makes you a better fisherman!

[Mr.T]

As far as marking fish 100 feet out to the side of the boat, never going over the top of them, setting up in front of them and catching them-I've seen it happen. Been in the boat, and caught one of the fish that we marked that way. Might not happen like that all the time, but it can happen.

No, you marked *something* that looked like a fish, tossed your bait out and caught *a* fish.

Sonar is just a snapshot of an instant in time (and a very thin snapshot at that), it's not a live underwater video. By the time you got the boat set up and got a line in the water, that fish you saw might have been in the same place or it might have moved away from the noise of the boat, or maybe it was never really there in the first place (rocks can look a lot like fish on side-imaging from a distance), or maybe it was an asian carp or a paddlefish.

So you really don't know if the fish you caught was the "blip" you saw on the sonar or not. If it makes you feel better to think that you caught *that* specific fish, I suppose that's fine. But you can't prove you're right any more than I can prove you're wrong...

[Kutter]

For the most part, I have resigned myself to using sonar on the Mississippi River, to show depth only. In normal settings, it shows millions of fish under me. As I lower the sensitivity, it shows no fish. Everyone tells me it is because of all the trash in the water, leaves, sticks etc, etc.. How can it pick leaves up, as they obviously do not have bladders? What about the bottom? Is that air on the bottom that is causing the sonar to pick it up? Not trying to be argumentative, I just don't understand the theory of the air bladders when it picks up things that obviously do not have air in them. If it picks up density, couldn't scales have a different return than skin? Most of the fish I do pick up on, are suspended and not moving very much, so I can see trying to fish directly for them.

[tbull]

This thread got a little heated I see...:ooooh:.......I believe whole heartedly that the sonar is picking up an air bladder, BUT...I also believe it is picking up more than that also. Previous poster had a great point, alot of newbies to fish finders keep that fish ID on sometimes, and it can throw back false signals, IE a stick, turtle, debris, as that cute little gold fish cracker looking fish picture. In theory its still producing the same sonar signal regardless if the fish ID is on or off right? So that being said, it would seem its scanning the surface of objects as well, and sending a false interpretation back that what you are seeing is a fish, so there has to be more to it than air bladders alone. What really confuses me is when the tutorials tell you that you get different colors back,from different strength of signals, so if I am marking a school of lets just say they "appear" to be good sized fish, all in the same location. Why are some yellow, others blue, green, etc?? On the Lowrance units, red is supposed to be a strong signal, sometimes you will get the big fat blue arch with red in the very middle, and sometimes a big fat yellow arch with red in the middle. Can anyone explain this in better detail?

I am not going to get on anyone for there opinion, what I do like about this site is its full of different opinions, and lets face it, if we weren't curious what others are thinking or doing, we wouldnt be on this forum.

[Mr.T]

you are really putting this info out here like it is a fact when in reality it is your opinion!!!

This is an internet message board. Everybody here is posting their opinion and nothing more, though some opinions are more informed than others. You can decide for yourself whether the author of any post you read is blowing smoke or not. If you think I'm just blowing smoke, that's fine. If you think I'm wrong, post *your* opinion instead.

if the sonar is seeing the air bladder then why do you see a log or other debris in the water without an air bladder lots of things show up as [fish] on sonar?

A lot of people don't really know how sonar works. This is a great introductory article if you want to read it: http://www.hightechfishing.com/lowrancetutorial.html - but I can sort of summarize here. Basically, sound waves are emitted into the water and bounce off of "things" in the water. How intensely the sound waves bounce (and thus, how how much of the sound wave gets back to the transducer and how it is depicted on your screen) is proportional to the difference in density between water and the "thing" the wave is bouncing off of - bigger difference, bigger return. Logs, leaves, bones and - yes - even scales are not the same density as the water they're in and all of them reflect sonar. Air (in a bladder or just a suspended bubble) is pretty much the most extreme difference in density that you'll find suspended in water and is going to reflect the most intense signal.

Do scales reflect sonar signals? Absolutely. And so do the skin and bones.

Do scales reflect *enough* sonar signal to appreciably change the shape of the return depicted on your display? Probably not.

Why? Because the shape of the return you see on the screen is impacted by lots of factors besides whether the fish has scales or not, not least of which is the orientation of the sonar transducer (if it's not perfectly horizontal, one end of the return will be cut off), the speed of the boat (faster boat = smaller returns and less detail), the speed of the fish and direction of travel, the depth of the return, the size of the object making the return, the orientation of the object relative to the path of the boat (maybe the fish is sideways to the boat or maybe it's pointed the same way the boat is traveling), the position of the object in the sonar cone and on and on.

If Lowrance or Hummingbird start advertising that their sonar can show the difference between a scaled and smooth fish, I might change my opinion. But that's not likely to happen.

[Sonny Kemp]

Im certainly not an expert on anything,especially sonar,though I do have considerable experience in retail and wholesale business and I would think it would be a heck of an advantage to any sonar company to be able to advertise their units could tell the difference in scaled and non-scaled fish,to everyone that would possibly listen instead of a select few that might hear a rep.somewhere.I just wonder why it's not nationally advertised.You reckon they're selling all they can make?:confused2:

[777]

Is it real or is it memorex:smile2:.

Heres what we have found that works for us. You can take this information and a buck 25 and buy ya a coke at most convenience stores:wink:.

On a lowrance unit a scaled fish will show from the bottom of the arch on one or sometimes both sides extending on past where the arch of the fish should end. A smoothed skin fish will not do this. On our Lowrance color graghs a catfish will show up with a yellow inside according to the ever allusive Lowrance man :ooooh:.

We have fished the other colored archs with limited success but when they are completely yellow or at least partially yellow in the middle then WE have confidence that they are catfish of some kind. And more times than not we are catching catfish in short order when we set up on this color of an arch. What you usually can't tell with archs is the size of the fish, When a yellow return shows up more like the shape of a mushroom instead of a typical arch then we have caught size associated with them. But the ever illusive Lowrance man didn't tell me that it's just something we have picked up on our own.

In my opinion if you are just using your sonar to find depths then you just as well buy you a $100 humingbird. If your not going to believe something your paying $500 to $2000+ for then why spend the money to begin with. And if you want a reliable, something you can believe in unit then you will need to spend a minimum of $500+ to get a good gragh.

You can take this post for what it is worth, Is it real or is it memorex.

Or is it just another idiot Blowing Smoke as Marty puts it:wink:, You make the call :smile2:.

[catcrazed]

So you really don't know if the fish you caught was the "blip" you saw on the sonar or not. If it makes you feel better to think that you caught *that* specific fish, I suppose that's fine. But you can't prove you're right any more than I can prove you're wrong...

I have an Opinion on this one actually but not lookin for trouble. Mr.T, I really pay attention to your posts because I truely think you do know what your doing when it comes to blue fishin. Thats a fact!! There is a handful of folks on the BOC thats info gets stored in my catfish knowledge box!! LOL When we have current here on the Ohio river we find current brakes so were looking for some type of structure OR HUMPS!! fish will lay just on the back side of a hump for a current brake. We don't have to see more than one good lookin fish behind a hump for us to fish it. That may have been the only fish we marked for 100yds of river. Anchor just up river, throw back to the fish and catch a fish. You are right though, no one can prove that they caught THAT FISH........ but there is no doubt in my mind that has happens with me and my catfishing partner on a daily basis. When we went out on our guided trip he showed us the ropes on how to do this. When he said you could mark fish and turn around and catch them, I told my uncle with me he was absolutely crazy. Man was I wrong. Every time we set up on fish we caught them. Just for craps and giggles we set up on a spot where we marked NO fish just to prove that what the technique he was showing us did work. It definetley does work in my mind but that is definetley my opinion.

[catcrazed]

I would like to know the answer to that too...I hear people say you can tell if its a catfish on the fish finder..HOW??? I hear people say you can watch your screen and watch the fish hit the bait on the fish finder screen HOW???

I fish for crappie very often When catfishin is not producing for me and we use this technique quite frequently. Have you ever been anchored up on a spot and seen a solid line suspend in the water column. Then it mysteriously goes away. That was a fish directly in your sonar cone. You prolly already knew that part. I know this could be done much more easy in a lake because there is no current in a lake. for instance, we fish paint creek for crappie. Sometimes when the fish go deep and suspend out in open water I mark fish when on the pedistal seat up front that show as the solid line on the graph. That means he is within the cone!! Drop a 16oz leadhead jig with a 1.5" tube and you can actually watch your jig go down. stop the jig at at the same depth as the fish and jig it up and down. It is actually really cool to because if you pick your rod tip up you will see your jighead sonar line move up at the same time. Put it on there nose and if they are hungry and biting you can catch fish like crazy like this. There is nothing better than looking at your lead head jig on the finder just above the fish line and you will see the fish line slowly come up and become one line with your jighead and 2 seconds later you feel the "tap". Im tellin ya, the first day I did that I felt like a was a true pro. In my own mind of course. I have watched them do this on in fisherman while ice fishing before.

[catcrazed]

One more thing that I will add to this post that may intrest folks. When I was kickin around the idea of buying the new humminbird side imaging graph I actually was doing more of my question asking on a crappie fishing forum that I am a part of. ............ Anyways I asked about this so called bladder thing also because the guy at basspro which definetly sounded like he knew what he was talking about said that the fish on the side imaging would show up as little white specs which was the air bladder. I asked around about this on the crappie website and man did they make the basspro guy look like an idiot. They said that was definetly not true and they sure enough proved it in style. a few of the guys actually got some shots of a diver with the new sideimaging. You could see the outline of a perfect person and what was evan neater about the snapshot was that you could actually see his shadow on the bottom just plain as day. Hands down the bladder thing doesnt mean crap to me after seeing these pics and there not phoney pics either. There the real deal. I wish I knew how to get those pics from that site and post them here. It would blow your mind. The crappie guys told me to print out the picture and take it to the bass pro sonar guy and tell him to explane that one. I figured I was lookin for trouble and didnt do it. TBULL saw these pictures also and can vouch for this post. Ill see if that guy can e-mail me the pics. Then I Know that i can post them.

[Steve Douglas]

this is my observation with my lowrance that is mounted to my trollin motor as im drifting!
well i do know that i never see arches on my Lowrance unless im in a bunch of scaled fish! i just assume there stripers or something, however while im drifting i can clearly monitor my bait and sinker, which shows up black,red, and blue, and not in any particular order! and every catfish Ive caught or seen rise up or descend down to inspect my bait has been a long thick continuous line, that appears out of nowhere! blue, yellow and red are the colors that mite show up as they appear. red and blue seem to dominate colors for cats that ive caught. i know several guys who claim they search out and mark fish, set up on them and catch them! but these same guys never out produce me at the scales but ill listen to there stories at the weigh-ins.
now, when one of these guys start spankin me and others by settin up on particular fish, with his finder and bringing the to the scales! then i mite digg in a lil more on the features of the finders so i can tune in and compete! i aint tryin to play with my depth finder while im fishin, adjustin here and there! im gonna say im comfortable with my skills at reading structure and catching fish that way with my finder!
but im not gonna say it cant be done, but i guarantee i will NEVER set up on ARCHES! structure is what im gonna look for!
my humminbird now thats a different animal!, i only use it for the side veiw feature to better help me find the structure!

BUT LOOK GUYS!
FISHING IS 80 PERCENT CONFIDENCE!!!!!!! SO IF YOUR COMFORTABLE IN the way that you use your tools for hunting fish, I WOULD DEFINENTLY STICK TO WHAT YOU LIKE AND BELEIVE IN!

good luck to all!

[Mr.T]

a few of the guys actually got some shots of a diver with the new sideimaging. You could see the outline of a perfect person and what was evan neater about the snapshot was that you could actually see his shadow on the bottom just plain as day. Hands down the bladder thing doesnt mean crap to me after seeing these pics and there not phoney pics either.

Side imaging is significantly different than traditional down-looking sonar. Much different frequencies (~800kHz vs ~192kHz) are involved and far more sophisticated receivers and software processing, which allows the unit to create photographic-like images of the bottom and structure.

Fish on side imaging still show up as little white blips, however. And the fish's swim bladder is primarily responsible for reflecting the sonar signal that created the blip.

[catcrazed]

Side imaging is significantly different than traditional down-looking sonar. Much different frequencies (~800kHz vs ~192kHz) are involved and far more sophisticated receivers and software processing, which allows the unit to create photographic-like images of the bottom and structure.

Fish on side imaging still show up as little white blips, however. And the fish's swim bladder is primarily responsible for reflecting the sonar signal that created the blip.

That is what the crappie fisherman said also about fish but as for the finder just picking up just a swim bladder I thought it was crazy that it had the outline of the diver and the shadow on the bottom was abosolutely amazing!! I know what your sayin though man!! I think that Im gonna order one through nerds sometime closer to spring. How would be the best way to go about gettin a dimmer installed???

[biga]

That is what the crappie fisherman said also about fish but as for the finder just picking up just a swim bladder I thought it was crazy that it had the outline of the diver and the shadow on the bottom was abosolutely amazing!! I know what your sayin though man!! I think that Im gonna order one through nerds sometime closer to spring. How would be the best way to go about gettin a dimmer installed??? the dimmable backlight is standard now... just order it and start using it..when you get it on your boat you can call me and i will help you get all the base line settings programed in so you dont have to experiment so much.. :cool2:

[olddriller]

Very interesting post , many thanks to Robin, Adam,Steve,PA-N-Ma, and outhers. for their input. I am dum as a post when it comes to any thing about fish finders. I have a new Lowrance 520c just got it from Lowrance. We were fishing yesterday AM. We were checking out a spot on the Lower Osage River , about 18 -23 ft. deep. We cought blues in this area last winter. We did some zig Zagging back and forth across the river , nnot seeing anything, We did find a few on the bottom and set up. We started seeing Gar coming to the surface all around us , You could see them breaking water for about 1/8 mile on one side of the river ( in the sun ). We were right in the middle of them, but the fish finder didnot show any supended fish. We only go a few bites and left. Anybody got any clues why theas gar were not showing up? Just wern't under the boat? Thanks again for taking time to give your opinion.

[cheapNdisgusting]

Bait balls. What you are seeing is the sonar return from air bladders in baitfish

[biga]

Bait balls. What you are seeing is the sonar return from air bladders in baitfish russel im not sure that what your seeingor not.. is you shrink your side imaging range down to 100ft each side you will get a much more detailed side scan image. as far as seeing the air bladders with side imaging that is bs. the local search and rescue and dnr have been using a 997 to find bodys of drowning victims.. i have seen screen shots of a body laying on the bottom of a lake and also a body suspended in the water and you can see the shadow of a human outline on the bottom not the outline of a bladder.. thanks for the post russel

[biga]

is it was seeing an air bladder then it wouldnt get this shot!!!

[GaryF]

While I don't have a position on fish type ID via regular sonar, I do have to agree that side imaging sees more than air bladders. I've seen pics of spoonbill where you could see the bill, for example. Perhaps the tiny air bubbles in the fish's bloodstream act like millions of tiny air bladders, or perhaps it's just the small density change between fish and water? I don't know, but clearly it shows the shape of the fish itself.

[Wabash River Bear]

If JW was around he would set ya'all straight. :crazy::ooooh::smile2:

[catcrazed]

is it was seeing an air bladder then it wouldnt get this shot!!!

what do you figure that is in that picture????

[biga]

what do you figure that is in that picture???? lol i know what it is.. what does it look like to you?

[biga]

salt water croc?

[cheapNdisgusting]

I know what side scan is capable of and in picture #1 is comparing side scan to normal downlooking sonar. In picture #1, the baitball looks like (on the left side)(down looking sonar) a bunch of little blue dots on my screen. On the right side is what it looks like on side scan when you run over a baitball. Your example looks like a saltwater croc to me and they are hard and very reflective to sonar pings. Great shot by the way. My other two pictures are of bait balls that were so thick in a cove mouth that It facinated me. Never saw them that thick before. In the "down sonar" shot you are looking at the top of the baitfish's back In side scan, you are looking at thier upper sides. No comparison of either will tell what kind of baitfish they are. Because of the speed of the boat and the direction the bait fish are swimming greatly affects the image. Just saying.

[cheapNdisgusting]

a person under the water. This is a scuba diver standing on the bottom.

[biga]

I know what side scan is capable of and in picture #1 is comparing side scan to normal downlooking sonar. In picture #1, the baitball looks like (on the left side)(down looking sonar) a bunch of little blue dots on my screen. On the right side is what it looks like on side scan when you run over a baitball. Your example looks like a saltwater croc to me and they are hard and very reflective to sonar pings. Great shot by the way. My other two pictures are of bait balls that were so thick in a cove mouth that It facinated me. Never saw them that thick before. In the "down sonar" shot you are looking at the top of the baitfish's back In side scan, you are looking at thier upper sides. No comparison of either will tell what kind of baitfish they are. Because of the speed of the boat and the direction the bait fish are swimming greatly affects the image. Just saying. :smile2: not doubting you at all russel thats just a different picture than what a bait ball looks like on the river here but it may verywell look so much different to me because of the depth you are reading but like i said shrink that range down a little and you will be really impressed with the difference!

[cheapNdisgusting]

Biga - I agree with you. Two points that I would like to make are #1 Any sonar reflection is totally up to the operator (you or me) to interpret. In the "diver" screenshot I posted above, - if it wasn't for "reading or interpreting" the shadow as a person you couldn't identify the actual sonar return as a scoba diver. Totally the operator's interpretation of what does that look like.

#2. Don't you think it is a little strange that you RARILY if ever actually see REALLY SEE a fish? If it worked - there would be billions of them.

One another subject - the damn things are really a lot of fun. Can you imagin sitting in a boat in a river and not have any idea what you are passing over? Best toy I ever bought.

[tbull]

If someone could I would like to see pics of your transducers mounted on your boat for the humminbird's. I have a 797c2si on my boat and have been fighting transducer mounting issues as of late.